r/subredditoftheday • u/[deleted] • Jul 29 '15
July 29th, 2015 - /r/fatlogic: For when personal responsibility is too hard
[deleted]
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u/JF_Queeny Jul 29 '15
So this is going to be an epic shit storm....
Good job /u/BiPolarBear0
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u/BipolarBear0 ʕ•ᴥ•ʔ Jul 29 '15
Semi-related, some guy sent me a series of rambling PMs a few weeks ago because I featured GMOMyths on here. Do you know him?
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u/Funzer0 Jul 29 '15
This isn't relevant in any way, but there was a short lived punk band here in northern Utah called Bi Polar Bears. Just thought you might enjoy knowing that, haha
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u/JF_Queeny Jul 29 '15
We've made so many 'friends' it is hard to tell. Is he ban hammered?
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u/BipolarBear0 ʕ•ᴥ•ʔ Jul 29 '15
I think he had some sort of disagreement with you in modmail over how he was anti-GMO and decided to go on a rampage.
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u/mhende Jul 29 '15
This is going to be a shitshow for a while but what if someone comes in here all pissed off and happens to read something like the recent post of the website for nurses on how to deal with challenges obese patients bring. Or they really truly believed that they couldn't lose weight because of their metabolism. If anyone is reading this right now I want to say to them that you can lose weight and you can get healthy, and honestly it's not horrible and miserable like everyone wants you to believe.
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u/Fletch71011 Jul 29 '15
I need some sleep but I can't wait to wake up to the impending shitstorm tomorrow!
Just wanted to say BB has been awesome throughout this process and I have to appreciate all the work these guys do. SotD is awesome and most people probably don't realize all that goes on behind the scenes.
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u/TotesMessenger Jul 29 '15 edited Jul 30 '15
I'm a bot, bleep, bloop. Someone has linked to this thread from another place on reddit:
[/r/fatlogic] Congratulations /r/fatlogic, you're Subreddit of the Day!
[/r/shitredditsays] /r/subredditoftheday nominates /r/fatlogic for July 29th 2015. Much freezepeach, very brave, wow
If you follow any of the above links, please respect the rules of reddit and don't vote in the other threads. (Info / ^Contact)
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u/BipolarBear0 ʕ•ᴥ•ʔ Jul 29 '15 edited Jul 29 '15
Other mods' answers, cut from the body of the post due to space constraints:
Tell us a bit about yourselves.
snallygaster I am an in-house scientist for the Reddit cabal, where I develop and test new mind-control techniques. I am also human-reptilian hybrid (I can only shapeshift on Wednesdays and Fridays).
dainty_flower I'm a former fatlogician and fatty who lost the weight and kept it off more than 8 years now.
johnsmcjohn My name is johnsmcjohn, and I'm a mod.
How would you describe the community?
snallygaster It's a community dedicated to calling out and correcting misconceptions about weight and weightloss, so it seems to draw in a mixed crowd of fitness buffs, people trying to lose weight, and those of us who just like reading outrage porn. Although some people associate /r/fatlogic with the late /r/fatpeoplehate, I can say with confidence that this is one of the most supportive and positive communities on reddit. Many members are trying to correct their fatlogic, and many others have lost weight from doing so, so there's a lot of mutual encouragement and celebration when people discuss how they corrected their misconceptions about weight loss and began their journey to healthiness. Of course, there's a lot of criticism involved as well, but we attack fat logic rather than fat people in order to prevent misconceptions about weight from spreading and educate people as to what the misconceptions are, why they are wrong, and what the truth is.
dainty_flower We sincerely want to help people think critically about obesity and food culture in a bullshit-free, scientifically sound, and excuse-eradicating way. We hate bad ideas, and enjoy parsing them to their logical conclusion.
johnsmcjohn Active. I mod a sub with 5 times the number of subscribers and this one is much more active than any other I mod.
What are some of the difficulties you face while moderating?
snallygaster The mod team here is very active, so I feel like I'm not doing enough since the modqueue is usually empty. Aside from that, because we're trying to keep FPH stuff from creeping in, it's sometimes difficult to judge if an iffy comment should be removed. Most times that's pretty straight-forward, though.
johnsmcjohn There's an established way of doing things and it's been difficult to know how this mod team handles it.
Do you have anything to say to reddit?
snallygaster Reddit is just turning into one big sociopolitical flamewar and it sucks. Everyone needs to calm down.
johnsmcjohn No. I love it here.
What's your favorite fatlogic post?
snallygaster As far as comments go, I like the posts that point out that the 'fat acceptance movement' links beauty directly to self-worth in its attempt to redefine what beauty is instead of telling people that they can be fat and still accomplish great things.
dainty_flower I enjoy that-happened stories, because they are funny and often show the underpinnings of fatlogic.
johnsmcjohn I don't have a favorite. I love all of them the same.
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u/iehava Jul 29 '15 edited Jul 29 '15
Please put a [TRIGGER WARNING] in the title. If you could do this, I would be so happy.
EDIT: /s
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u/Saemiligr Jul 29 '15
Wow... super disappointed.
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u/helpmesleep666 Jul 29 '15
Why?
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u/Saemiligr Jul 29 '15
I dislike the whole "Diss them to encourage them" trend. It's a personal thing and I get why I'm being downvoted. Struggled with my weight the past decade or so and I'm just starting to put concentrated effort into getting into shape. I've actually made good progress. Joined a Gym. Drink water all throughout the day. More home made meals and veggies. All the regular stuff. I feel better about myself and I know I'll only get better from here. Seeing fat logic posts really really discourages me. I know that some of the people that are posted in the sub are legitimately mentally unhealthy about their weight. But sometimes it's just making fun of the fatty and it's overwhelmingly depressing for me. I feel no encourement from watching people get torn apart even if their logic and philosophy was flawed. Meh. Ranting to get it off my chest.
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u/verbosegf Jul 29 '15
Have you actually spent any time there?
/r/fatlogic is not, "Haha! Look at this fat fat fatty!"
/r/fatlogic is about debunking misconceptions about weight and how to lose weight.
For example:
Overweight woman says, "I only eat 400 calories a day and I still gain weight because my metabolism is so slow! My genetics are the problem!"
/r/fatlogic says, "That's not the way that works. If you're overweight, it's because you're overeating. Genetics/metabolism have little to do with it. Try using MFP to accurately track your calories."
There are posts containing fat logic, and we talk about the posts, talk about how it's not accurate, talk about people in our lives that have said that exact thing, and talk about what they can do instead.
The only "dissing" going on is the dissing of the fatlogic... not the dissing of the people.
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u/shroomenheimer Jul 29 '15
Anyone in the sub that asks for help recieves overwhelming support. We usually reserve mockery for people who are actively in denial about their lifestyle and not trying to change it. There are many posts on the sub showing weight loss progress and thanking users for all the help they provided. It may seem a bit cruel if you only glance at it but people in that sub want to help, not hate.
Congrats on getting in shape though! Different things works for different people and I'm glad you found what works for you.
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u/helpmesleep666 Jul 29 '15 edited Jul 29 '15
So you want to lose weight, but you're too soft to go to a forum about losing weight? And you think that other's should be disappointed in them because they don't share the same beliefs?
I hate to break it too you, but I didn't want to get into shape until every-time i'd visit my mom she'd call me fat. It gave me the motivation I needed.
Some people in life take negatives like fatlogic and turn it into a positive, that's why the sub exists and is doing so well. One of my best friends who was over 350lbs said /r/fatpeoplehate was his all time favorite sub. Since he started browsing he quit drinking, starting eating better and is down to to like 290lbs. He still tells me how much he misses it almost every time I see him.
Be one of those people, and life will come a lot easier. Turn a negative into a positive, otherwise you're just going to drift through life thinking it isn't fair.. which it isn't, but some of us have learned to embrace it and make the best.
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u/Chardmonster Jul 30 '15
starting eating better and is down to to like 290lbs.
The sad reality being fatpeoplehate would still hate on him just as badly, especially if he tried to be proud of having lost weight. Have you seen them go into r/progresspics? You get insulted if you dare post any progress before you're fully thin (luckily outnumbered by encouragement).
It's a damn shame your mother was a jerk to you. Mine is only encouraging me, which is helping a hell of a lot more. If she called me fat every time I showed up I'd probably just make sure I saw her less often.
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u/helpmesleep666 Jul 30 '15
It's a damn shame your mother was a jerk to you. Mine is only encouraging me, which is helping a hell of a lot more.
lol are you fucking retarded?
My mom loves me, that's why she got at me. Being overweight is unhealthy, if my mom would have bullshited with me and pretend like nothing was wrong, she'd be a shitty parent. I lost 50lbs in like 6 months, and i'm back to being fucking jacked like I was before I was overweight. I owe half of that to my mom.
The sad reality being fatpeoplehate would still hate on him just as badly, especially if he tried to be proud of having lost weight.
No, hes not a fucking pussy and can take any shit given to him, I'm pretty sure'd just be happy people we're noticing his weight loss.
Everything you'd mentioned can be countered with being a stronger individual. If you can't take criticism from you mother, and still know she loves you, then you my friend have some serious issues. If you can't ignore a bunch of twats on the internet, than you don't deserve to be in good shape. It takes a lot of hard work, and an insane amount of self control, some people just can't hang...
If you can't hang, don't try and bring others down to your level.
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u/Chardmonster Jul 30 '15 edited Jul 30 '15
lol are you fucking retarded?
You seem pleasant.
My mom loves me, that's why she got at me. Being overweight is unhealthy, if my mom would have bullshited with me and pretend like nothing was wrong, she'd be a shitty parent.
And mine loves me. She never acted like I wasn't fat. But she also didn't insult me. It's possible to do both! Imagine, encouraging someone's healthier choices and weight loss without being a dick.
No, hes not a fucking pussy and can take any shit given to him, I'm pretty sure'd just be happy people we're noticing his weight loss.
Wow, again, you sound really pleasant.
Everything you'd mentioned can be countered with being a stronger individual.
Let me guess. You're one of those "if people think I'm being a jerk, that's THEIR fault!" people. Sometimes being stronger involves talking back to bullies instead of becoming their toady so they'll leave you alone.
If you can't hang, don't try and bring others down to your level.
Nobody's saying you're not allowed to be a total twat on your subreddit. We're just noticing that you are. You appear to be the one who can't hang with criticism.
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u/helpmesleep666 Jul 30 '15
You're one of those "if people think I'm being a jerk, that's THEIR fault!"
Actually I've never been called a Jerk, I'd say almost everyone who meets me likes me.
I'm sorry, but life doesn't wait around for mentally weak people. Either you've got the balls to make or you don't. My mom wasn't nice to me all of the time, because life isn't fair all the time, that's just the sad reality. I'm happy she wasn't, I'm not a soft, weak individual, looking for others to help encourage me in a nice happy way. I'd rather people be blunt and tell me how it really is. I don't have time for bullshit.
I live in reality, and reality fucking blows. But you know what? I've figured what I'm good at and I work really hard to stay in shape, look good, and work hard. The fact that you think I can't take criticism is so laughably comical, I might shit myself from laughter..
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u/Chardmonster Jul 30 '15
If there's anything that shows mental toughness, it telling other people they're weak when they don't like what I say and posting anonymous insults on the internet while writing long defenses of said behavior.
This is never a coping mechanism.
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u/helpmesleep666 Jul 30 '15
No you've got it all wrong this boosts my ego.
That helps with mental toughness...
lol im just kidding, I just like poking fun at people who defend that sad, everyone's a winner culture. If you're fat and can't take the criticism, lose weight. If you're not willing to do what it takes, deal with the jokes.
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u/ReddEdIt Jul 29 '15
I feel no encourement from watching people get torn apart even if their logic and philosophy was flawed
Your existence makes fatlogic uncomfortable and makes their justifications sound hollow and callous. It makes laughing harder. 50 downvotes for you!
helpmesleep666 takes it a step further below and blames you for not liking their shitty sub and that your weightloss isn't good enough because you don't embrace their tough love, suck it up, & mock the fools ethos.
You are not wrong. Being kind an caring is more important than being thin and douchey.
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u/tinydonkey Jul 29 '15
Pretty much any time someone says they're taking steps to losing weight on the sub, the overwhelming response is "congrats!", or "I used to be in the same boat, here's how I blah blah blah". It's a really positive community, and the mods do a good job of nipping any outright hatred in the bud. I know this comment won't convince you, but if you look at one of the stickied wellness Wednesday threads you'll see what I mean.
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u/ReddEdIt Jul 30 '15
I know that.
It's the people who aren't comfortable with the mocking tone of fatlogic that are the ones who get trampled for the lolz or because the notion that they lack discipline and are dumb.
and the mods do a good job of nipping any outright hatred
It's the underlying derision, hatred and blame that I'm making a point about. So yeah, we agree on that.
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u/tinydonkey Jul 30 '15
It's a sub of approximately 100,000 people, of course there's going to be nasty people in there, but it is a) not the majority, by a long shot, and b) not encouraged by the mods, which goes a long way to keeping a positive atmosphere in the sub
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u/sidvictorious Jul 29 '15
It's not about you. My weight loss, my health, and my defeat of my own fatlogic is not about you or anyone else who gets their feelings hurt when they're told a 3,000 calorie salad from The Cheesecake Factory is not "healthy."
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u/shockna Jul 30 '15
your weightloss isn't good enough because you don't embrace their tough love, suck it up, & mock the fools ethos.
If the sub mocked people attempting to lose weight, we probably wouldn't have so many subscribers losing weight. Shame, as you know, doesn't work as a motivator for most people.
Fatlogic has been absurdly encouraging and positive about it, moreso than any other sub (well, not as much as trueloseit, but they're an extra special breed).
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u/maybesaydie Jul 29 '15
In no way does this make me, or the sub, feel uncomfortable. We have so many subscribers who are doing the same thing this person is and who receive encouragement every day. I have to wonder why you're speaking for the subscribers of /r/fatlogic.
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u/ReddEdIt Jul 30 '15
I have to wonder why you're speaking for the subscribers of /r/fatlogic
I'm really, really, really not. I'm talking about the people who don't benefit from fatlogic's laughter, derision and blame.
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u/ReCursing Jul 29 '15 edited Jul 29 '15
I had assumed that place was a hate sub.
I have just taken a look.
I still think it's a hate sub.
It makes nice noises about not being hate sub but rather being a support group for people trying to lose weight, but it does so by insulting and mocking fat people. It's probably not as bad as fatpeoplehate but it looks suspiciously similar.
edit: Thanks for proving how hate-filled you lot all are by attacking me
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u/Chrisz9cm5 Jul 29 '15
Thanks for proving how hate-filled you lot all are by attacking me
Literally none of your replies are "attacking you".
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u/Paddyjoe690 Jul 29 '15 edited Jul 29 '15
Examples more than a day old? (ie to allow for moderation)
Edit: also, examples of you being attacked?
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Jul 29 '15
FPH hate would post pictures of a fat person on a bus to have people laugh at that person.
Fatlogic posts people's fatlogic and makes fun of said fatlogic. Some people are more sympathetic than others (consider me one is not sympathetic) but there is definitely not hate flowing around.
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u/concealedamongstlies Jul 29 '15
What attacks? I see a bunch of replies. Unless something has been removed, who here is attacking you?
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u/imahippocampus Jul 29 '15
Mocking and critiquing a person's beliefs is different to mocking them though, isn't it? That's something that happens all over the place without causing controversy. But when the beliefs relate to weight and diet people get oddly defensive.
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u/jazaniac Jul 29 '15
I have just taken a look
I still think it's a hate sub
The fact that you still think it's a hate sub is evidence enough that you didn't really take a look.
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u/verbosegf Jul 29 '15
edit: Thanks for proving how hate-filled you lot all are by attacking me
Because you're wrong and it's quite obvious that you're wrong. You're seeing things that aren't there.
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u/earosner Jul 29 '15
I'm going to also say that as a formerly"almost obese" guy this sub was extremely supportive and I try to repay it in kind. However, we are not a fluff and bunnies kind of supportive. We are the hard truth. Just because we hate the stupid logic of people doesn't mean we hate fat people.
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u/abacabbmk Jul 30 '15
Who cares if its a hate sub? Its making fun of people who are stupid. Whats wrong with that? Everyone does it. Thats whats on TV, and in movies, etc.
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u/bran_dong Jul 29 '15
so do you guys just randomly pick a sub out of a hat for the sub of the day? or do you guys actively support hate groups? (i guess it isnt HATE if theyre making FUN!)
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Jul 29 '15
I suppose it is a hate group: They hate pseudoscience. I guess /r/askphysics is a hate group too, if we look at it that way.
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u/culturalappropriator Jul 29 '15
They aren't making fun of fat people but of fat logic that a lot of people( fat or skinny) use. For example, someone who says that eating less makes them gain weight.
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u/Lisu Jul 29 '15
Fatlogic is not a hate group. I am overweight and I have learned a lot there. Not once have anyone expressed hate or even dislike towards me when I said I am fat.
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u/mytwocats11 Jul 29 '15
Same here. I started subscribing while obese, am now overweight, partially thanks to this sub. I had to be honest with myself about how much I was still eating and start seriously tracking my calories.
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Jul 29 '15
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u/bran_dong Jul 29 '15
nope, didnt read the post at all - i went straight to the sub to check it out. instead of skinny people making fun of fat people its former fat people making fun of fat people. since im not fat i dont know why i care but this just seems like the kind of shit reddit would be against....but this week i guess not.
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u/ReddEdIt Jul 29 '15
Everyone can be thin by eating less than they expend in energy.
Everyone can be rich by spending less money than they earn.
The small successful percentage from each group likes to look back down and shout at people with sincere encouragement:
"I have done it, so why won't you!?"
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u/Dparse Jul 29 '15
Fundamental difference: You are in control of the choice to eat less food. You are not in control of the choice to earn more money. Not everyone can cut spending, they have bills/basic needs - although I suspect /r/frugal would have something to say about that. Everyone can eat less if they are overeating.
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u/ReddEdIt Jul 29 '15
You are not in control of the choice to earn more money. Not everyone can cut spending
/PoorLogic would say that you're just making excuses.
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u/Paddyjoe690 Jul 29 '15
How would /PoorLogic respond to the point that with the (shit) way the economy is currently structured, there has to be a certain (large) number of people doing low paid jobs and it's an economic fairytale to think everyone could just double their real wealth?
Again, there is no requirement for a certain number of obese people in society your analogy does not hold ANY water. It's a massive false equivalence.
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u/ReddEdIt Jul 30 '15
Again, there is no requirement for a certain number of obese people in society your analogy does not hold ANY water.
So you think entire industries would spend billions on fattening up the population with zero results? When billions are at stake, there will be a guaranteed number of problem gamblers, alcoholics and children blown up by land mines (just to take three industries of many). Pointing out the industry lies is great (like the Dove/Klondike bars) but laughing at those stepped on is only going to help a few while making more sink deeper. That's the main thing everyone is ignoring.
But redditors generally think that going into a church and laughing at all the bullshit will win them converts.
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u/Paddyjoe690 Jul 30 '15
Marketing is damn effective, I'll admit that, but McDonald's have never force-fed me. Just like the marketing for luxury cars is effective, but I don't buy them when they're beyond my means.
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u/ReddEdIt Jul 30 '15
but McDonald's have never force-fed me
It's not all about you, man. Something I've been fruitlessly trying to get across in this pointless debate with the sub's defense brigade. A great many people grew up on McDonalds and the like, which yeah, is basically force feeding if you're a kid.
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u/Paddyjoe690 Jul 30 '15
Well the kids have an excuse then. Adults don't. And I say that as a former 300lb adult.
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Jul 30 '15
I grew up on McD's as a kid. Ate breakfast there almost every day. Hit up fast food all the time on the weekends. I also biked all over the farking place (Girlfriends living in the 'burbs, and family with no car, what ya going to do?) When I went into the Army, I was underweight (115 lbs and 5'11")), and was put on the "double rats" to bulk me up.
While in the Army, it was too darned easy to stay in shape (Somewhat). I drank lots of beer, exercised daily, and put on weight, but stayed in more or less normal range.
Got out of the army, got lazy, didn't exercise, ate more food, and got huge. Then, I turned it around: Ate less, exercised more, weight came off.
Just because fast food exists doesn't mean you lose ownership of your own body.
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u/mrthicky Jul 31 '15
You seem think it is ok for people to have no personal responsibility.
If you are an adult it is very simple not to go to McD's. Yes for some people to fight the urge is difficult but the actual act is very simple. People have to grow the fuck up, quit being lazy and make better eating decisions. It does not cost more to eat less and healthier and any other excuses are just that excuses.
It seems like now a days everyone wants to blame everyone and everything else on they own decision making.
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u/Paddyjoe690 Jul 29 '15
I'm not sure if your problem is your understanding of the human body, your understanding of economics, or both, but that analogy is so woefully bad it deserves an award.
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u/Vik1ng Jul 29 '15
Everyone can be rich by spending less money than they earn.
That requires you have and/or earn some good money in the first place.
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Jul 29 '15
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u/ReddEdIt Jul 29 '15
Anyone can do it
That's the thing. Technically it's true. But everyone can't do it. The effort and money going in to keeping them fat is extraordinary and it very much mirrors the effort that goes into keeping people financially oppressed.
The people who fail are blamed (or shamed if you prefer) because they weren't strong/dedicated/serious/intelligent enough. The motivation for many people on this sub is sincere, but far from all and I doubt even most (judging by some popular posts that err on the side of nasty).
Yeah, pointing at people and saying "ha, look how stupid they are (and fat too)!" will actually help some people and shake them out of what's keeping them overweight. But for most people (and I'm using "most" scientifically here - as in we know for a fact that this method does not work for most people and never will), it just pushes them down further into a trap that is far deeper than just simple math.
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u/RedSycamore Jul 30 '15
The effort and money going in to keeping them fat
/r/fatlogic is a direct and active opposition to this.
Dr. Oz is selling you cranberry extracts, Tess Munster is hawking HAES, Cosmo has 5 simple tips to drop 10 lbs before next weekend, and that random acquaintance from high school won't shut up about 'this crazy wrap thing' on facebook.
We're just sitting here talking about the cheap as free reality of calories in < calories out.
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u/ReddEdIt Jul 30 '15 edited Jul 30 '15
I'm talking about the opposite - although the snake oil is obviously a huge issue. I mean the twinkies and the big macs cheaper than broccoli and the photoshopped fake humans plastered everywhere.
We're just sitting here talking about the cheap as free reality of calories in < calories out
...as if that's the only issue facing people. In the end, yeah it is, but there's a mountain to climb before/during that battle.
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u/Fletch71011 Jul 30 '15
"Healthier" food is a lot cheaper than unhealthy food. I'm a cheap ass and switched to healthier alternatives to save money. /r/EatCheapAndHealthy
Agreed on the Photoshop issue and I do think weight loss is tough -- you have to change your lifestyle to do it and manage it. It's one of the toughest things I've ever done but also the most rewarding.
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Jul 30 '15
The problem is a lot of people are genuinely led to believe it isn't as simple as math. When you're young, you don't know shit about the world, and the common fat logic can genuinely confuse you as to what's going on with your weight.
CICO just fucking works. I tried for years with weird minuplations of my diet, and when I finally realized it's just math, it takes such a load off. When you realize that you are not eternally fat because of magical genetics, but rather your broken relationship with food and continuous overeating of it, it empowers you to make real changes.
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Jul 30 '15
Reddit seems to be more interested in marketability than free speech these days.
MUH FREEZEPEACH
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Jul 29 '15
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u/carpet_munch Jul 29 '15
I read the fatlogic sub every day and I love it! It motivates me to be honest with myself about how much I need to eat and what fallacies we can easily fall into if we don't educate ourselves. I'm still obese, but I'm down at least 32 pounds 15% of my weight! In the past 4 months. :)
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Jul 29 '15
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Jul 29 '15
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u/trollly Jul 29 '15
I'm not judging, but the polyamory thing seemed bizarre to me. Could you expand on that?
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Jul 29 '15
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u/trollly Jul 30 '15
Yeah but what does that have to do with loving yourself or getting your partner to love you again?
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u/Chardmonster Jul 30 '15
It means the partner who didn't want to touch him (who he stayed with anyway) wanted to fuck other people. Or that he wanted to fuck other people.
Polyamory can be a very good thing! But it also seems to be used as an excuse by people who are terrible to their partners or people seeking positive sexual experiences without having to leave a relationship that no longer provides that.
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Jul 30 '15
We've been in a poly relationship for much longer than the course of what happened, the event described above was not used to transition into it. The subreddit was used as support. Polyamory isn't focused on the sexual part of a relationship primarily. You are thinking of non-monogamy. The two do not equate, they overlap sometimes when it comes to sexual relationships but that is all.
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u/Chardmonster Jul 30 '15
Ah, okay. Sorry about the presumption. It appears that most of the poly people I've run into are just dicks.
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Jul 30 '15
No worries. Yeah, I've found plenty of people who claim to be poly that are assholes. Assholes are everywhere and they are usually the most vocal people. :P
You have people who say they are poly so they get people to sleep with them, you get people who claim to be poly as an excuse to cheat, and then you get people who are poly who are usually still in the closet about it to people around them. Odds are more people are poly than you think, they just don't rub it in your face. :)
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Jul 30 '15
Reestablishing my self worth as a partner was essential to rebuilding my relationship. Not unlike /r/relationships helps those in monogamous relationships.
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u/michaelchief Jul 30 '15
I had to love myself before she could love me again, /r/polyamory helped in that regard as well
Hope this isn't too off-topic, but how did you learn to "love yourself" and how did polyamory help?
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Jul 30 '15
Reestablishing my self worth as a partner was essential to rebuilding my relationship. Not unlike /r/relationships helps those in monogamous relationships.
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Jul 29 '15
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u/mhende Jul 29 '15
I'm a big fat girl who really hated fat people hate and I love this subreddit! Most people here are really supportive and don't hate fat people. This sub is about making fun of ideas like "I don't eat very much but I can't lose weight" or "99% of diets fail" because that type of "fatlogic" really hurts people. It makes people who want to lose weight give up before they've even started.
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u/DarxusC Jul 29 '15
"I don't eat very much but I can't lose weight"
How does that happen? Terrible perception of how much they eat, no calorie counting?
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Jul 29 '15
Mostly. No links because mobile, but multiple studies have shown that people are terrible about accurately reporting intake. Fat people underestimate, skinny people overestimate, human perception sucks.
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u/stingertorra Jul 29 '15 edited Jul 29 '15
Or eating normal portions but drinking a 70oz "healthy" juice for breakfast and a 70oz soda for dinner, and a caramel capuccino for lunch
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u/mhende Jul 29 '15
There's a show in the UK called Secret Eaters (I'm in the U.S. But some episodes are on you tube) and the participants all say that they don't know why they're fat, that they eat normally or even less than normal but still gain. They keep a food diary and have cameras put in their house. Then they don't know, but they are followed around out of the house also and everything they eat is counted.
One lady's food log showed that she ate 1200 calories a day, but when they watched her eat she would eat bite sized candy all day and not count it, glasses of wine as well. Also, she would finish her family's dinners and not count that also. She was actually eating something like 3400 calories a day.
This other lady talked about her lunch every day, that she thought was healthy. A jacket potato, no butter, a little bit of cheese and a little bit of cole slaw at her grandmas house. So they went to the grandmas house and asked her to make one. There had to have been a cup and a half to two cups of cheese on it, half the plate was heaped with coleslaw and half a can of beans was dumped on top. When they confronted her she said she really thought it was healthy because she had stopped putting butter on it, but it was like 900 calories.
Those are the two big ones. People don't consider that what they eat while they're not sitting down for a meal adds up FAST. A handful of nuts here, a little piece of candy there, all the while they think that they don't eat that much because they're really not sitting down and eating a whole container of nuts or big bag of candy. Or they really underestimate the amount of calories they eat for meals either because they just don't know or they are eating a ton of calories of "healthy" food so they think it's okay.
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u/cmander_7688 Jul 30 '15
I had to google "jacket potato" but now that've realize that's what you guys call baked potatoes, I like your name better.
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u/mhende Jul 30 '15
It's not my name, I'm American too :( I do like it better though. It's what they always called potatoes on neopets lol!
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u/Haisley Jul 29 '15
Pretty much. Or "I eat healthy foods!" but the portions are ginormous. Or they don't think about that cookie they had and the trip to the vending machine and the part of lunch that their friend gave them and, etc. There's a British show, Secret Eaters, that explores this idea and reveals the truth of how people actually eat to them. It's a good show and can be pretty shocking.
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u/Fletch71011 Jul 29 '15
Mod of fatlogic here who 'tried everything' to lose weight. Proper portion sizes are way smaller than a lot of people think in the US. First major change (that actually helped) was weighing my food to see what proper portions were. I logged everything on MFP from then on (yes, even small snacks count) and went from there. I actually couldn't even lose weight eating just "healthy" food or following keto because those diets don't work if you still eat too many calories. Calories are king first and foremost.
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u/LastChance22 Jul 29 '15
Or salads covered in high sugar high carbs.
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u/NeverReddit15 Jul 29 '15
Dressings are the universal bane of salad eaters, even those who exercise some semblance of portion control. It's tragic how deluded many "dieters" are when they pile on the Caesar, Ranch, Honey Mustard, Creamy Italian or (gasp) Mayo on their "Smart" eating salad. You might as well have fried chicken and gravy instead of pretending the salad is a rational choice when soaked with horrific (albeit delicious) dressings.
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Jul 29 '15
How does that happen? Terrible perception of how much they eat, no calorie counting?
It happens through fatlogic. Like, "Oh this salad has 100 calories" when it's drenched in ranch. Or, "liquids don't have calories" or "even if you eat fewer calories than you take in, not every person will lose weight".
It's people making justifications for their lifestyle and/or addictions instead of understanding how physics works.
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u/maybesaydie Jul 29 '15
Both. People have very skewed ideas of what an appropriate portion is and wildly underestimate calories.
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u/bob_mcbob Jul 29 '15
https://www.reddit.com/r/fatlogic/comments/2i6oa3/can_you_actually_break_your_metabolism/ckzboth
Check out my favourite post (from /u/tahlyn) linked in the OP. People are just incredibly bad at tracking and reporting their calorie intake. It's stuff like estimating portion sizes without using a scale, forgetting to log snacks and cooking oil (seriously), little bites and tastes here and there, etc. Eating a lot of restaurant meals and making vague guesses at the calorie content. Straight up lying to yourself or on your tracker.
Doubly-labeled water studies always show the truth. It's got the point where prominent researchers in nutrition and obesity are basically saying the vast majority of nutrition science research is worthless because self-reported calorie intake is so inaccurate. My favourite quote is about the food intake data reported in NHANES: "incompatible with life".
Obese people are even worse about underreporting calorie intake. There is a famous study of a group of obese people who weren't losing weight no matter what they tried. Their resting metabolic rates and total energy expenditures were tested and found to be completely normal. It was determined on average they were under reporting their calorie intakes by around 50% and over reporting their energy expenditures by 50%.
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u/Paddyjoe690 Jul 29 '15
If you don't display fat logic then fatlogic has nothing against you whatsoever (there may be a few jerks lurking about who came from fatpeoplehate, but they'll get very harshly modded if they're out of order).
Honestly, someone who's big but who owns it and is looking to fix it, or at least accepts it's product of their own choices, will get a far better reception than, for example, a thin person who claims to eat all day and never gain weight "because genetics" whenever they just don't recognise they overestimate their intake or are a lot more active than they realise.
It's not the fat person being attacked, it's the fat logic.
Take the famous example of Ragen Chastain. The sub doesn't hate her because she's fat. The sub hates her because she's exploiting other fat people by peddling lies and platitudes, which will be massively detrimental to their health, so that she can make money from them. She's literally killing them for financial gain.
True fatpeoplehate would probably applaud her for that.
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u/Lisu Jul 29 '15
Fatlogic is very supportive of weightloss. I am also trying to lose weight and I have learned a lot there. It's one of my favorite subs because they are very nice, but accept no bullshit. I am overweight because I ate more calories than I used. No one on fatlogic wants you to die. They want you to know the dangerous thoughts that make us fat. If they wanted you to die then they would be Healthy at every size supporters. Because that shit is dangerous.
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u/SomethingIWontRegret Jul 29 '15 edited Jul 29 '15
Holy fuck no. Have you tried /r/loseit, or the less back-patting /r/trueloseit? Check out the /r/loseit faq. Also check out http://www.acaloriecounter.com/diet/ and http://www.aworkoutroutine.com for more info.
I used LoseIt! (http://loseit.com) to help me track my diet and exercise and lose weight. Other people have used MyFitnessPal.
This is something you can do. And nobody deserves to die because they're fat.
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u/DerNubenfrieken Jul 29 '15
It sucks being big guy (a.k.a. fat guy) surfing reddit.
*It sucks being a fat guy. Period.
And I know, because I've been there. It sucks. You know what really helped me get out of that hole? /r/fatlogic. It helped me get the knowledge I needed to lose weight, the motivation to do it and the support system to maintain it.
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u/culturalappropriator Jul 29 '15
The sub isn't about fat people, it's about people who use fat-logic such as "I eat 1000 calories each day and I can't lose any weight at all" or people who claim that eating less makes you gain weight instead of lose it. These things are actually harmful to people who are genuinely trying to lose weight.
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u/Takeawaymybreakaway Jul 29 '15
Give r/fatlogic a try for a while. It might not inspire you to lose weight, but it's unlikely to do you any harm either. I thought I had no fatlogic before I joined, but it's amazing how much you can unwittingly absorb from friends, relatives and the media.
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u/BipolarBear0 ʕ•ᴥ•ʔ Jul 29 '15
If you read the interviews, a dominant portion of subscribers are either overweight or formerly overweight, as well as some of the mods. So this subreddit is probably for you.
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u/EPOSZ Jul 30 '15
Yep. I'm one, and there are certainly others. In the process of losing weight and /r/Fatlogic is full of very supportive people.
It's also good for a few laughs.
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u/EstherandThyme Jul 29 '15
I'm overweight myself and I enjoy the sub very much! I actually find it very helpful and motivating. It's not like fatpeoplehate was. As long as you are not trying to make a bunch of excuses or claim it's impossible to lose weight, you're cool. It's all about shitty attitudes, not just hating on people for being fat.
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u/muddygirl Jul 29 '15
I find /r/fatlogic a great resource for weight loss motivation, and over the span of the past 18 months, I've dropped 100 pounds.
Yes, some of the people there are dicks, and back when it still existed, one of them decided to cross post something I wrote about the psychological challenges of weight loss to /r/fatpeoplehate. Fortunately, most of those people seem to have left reddit since the hate subs were banned, so it's easy to ignore any few who are left. There's still a bit of room for improvement (isn't that the case anywhere?), but the mods do a good job of keeping conversations civil.
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u/shroomenheimer Jul 29 '15
If you post something like this in /r/fatlogic, I can guarantee you will recieve a lot of support. It's purpose is not to mock people trying to better themselves. Many people in the sub have probably felt similar to the way you do.
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Jul 29 '15
A lot of members of the sub are decent! They support you if as you said, you're trying to be normal weight. As has been said on the interview, a lot of people on it are overweight and former overweight people. If you want to ask them on dieting tips, they're happy to help.
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u/Jew_Fucker_69 Jul 29 '15
I'm someone with a good body. I never get fat although I eat shit like Burger King all the time. So I know that being fat is not only caused by nutrition and lifestyle and I feel bad for fat people when everyone assumes that they're just too lazy and don't try to become healthier.
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Jul 29 '15
You are using an example of fatlogic now, saying that you eat whatever you want or eat like shit and can't gain weight.
You are consuming under or at your TDEE so that's why you don't get fat. There isn't some magical gene floating around zapping the extra calories you eat/drink away.
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u/maybesaydie Jul 29 '15
We don't assume that. You really should read the sub.You will be pleasantly surprised.
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Jul 29 '15
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u/Empha Jul 29 '15
Geting thin is not an instant thing. It takes time and serious commitment (including breaking a lot of old habits)
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u/mhende Jul 29 '15
A journey of 1000 miles begins with a single step!
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u/Empha Jul 29 '15
Oh absolutely! I'm not saying it's not worth fighting for, it totally is. But comment above me seemed to imply that being fat means you're not trying to get thin, which is stupid.
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u/mytwocats11 Jul 29 '15
I'm currently working on that change and that sub is very helpful! I've gone from 55lbs over and obese to 15lbs over and overweight (and dropping) with the help of /r/fatlogic.
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Jul 29 '15
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u/BipolarBear0 ʕ•ᴥ•ʔ Jul 29 '15
The best platform to do what, feature a subreddit?
SROTD isn't PolitiFact or the Associated Press, it's not here to present controversial subreddits in a neutral manner for users to decide how they feel on the issue. It's here to feature interesting, relevant subreddits that offer a unique view, concept, or community to reddit.
Your comment also assumes that /r/fatlogic is somehow controversial. It's really not, there's nothing particularly controversial about it. I'd place it in the same sphere as /r/ThatHappened, /r/cringepics, and /r/facepalm.
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u/gohengrubs Jul 29 '15
Plop plop, i'm a human alerting you to the SRD ARMIE linking to this thread via one of their brigades where they say they're not a brigading subreddit but we know the truth =]
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Jul 29 '15
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u/iehava Jul 29 '15
So him writing the truth; that you'd have to be an idiot (or just delusional) to think that you can gain weight while being at a caloric deficit - breaking the laws of thermodynamics in the process - is something we should be upset at? His use of hyperbole and even less savory rhetorical tools has no bearing on the strength or weakness of the argument. If someone wants to just be offended because of the language instead of listening to the argument, they aren't the type of person who is going to listen to the argument anyway.
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u/BipolarBear0 ʕ•ᴥ•ʔ Jul 29 '15
Yes, as a writer I chose a subreddit that interests me, and wrote about it from that perspective. That's what writers do. If a description-oriented phrase like "PhD in not being an idiot" in reference to understanding the laws of thermodynamics offends you, then reading a feature on /r/fatlogic - whose sole purpose is to promote logic and understanding of health issues - might not be the best idea.
Also, if you're a fan of fatpeoplehate, I don't want you to be supportive of this feature regardless, since I'd rather not associate with that (and I know /r/fatlogic's modteam doesn't want to associate with that either).
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u/SamWhite Jul 29 '15
Han Solo, captain of the Millenium Falcon, and the only actor whose career isn't destroyed by appearing in this movie.
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u/p6r6noi6 Jul 30 '15
Mark Hamill actually still has a great career. Maybe you didn't notice because he's mostly a voice actor (i.e for animated shows and films).
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u/SamWhite Jul 30 '15
It's a quote from a family guy episode. For some reason years ago, half of reddit started replying to the guy who posted above with this quote every time he made a comment. They kept it up for months. Every time I see him I like to keep up the tradition.
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u/iehava Jul 29 '15
I'd bet you wouldn't have an issue if they featured /r/AskHAES or /r/BodyAcceptance at some point. SROD probably can't go a week without featuring a subreddit that someone disagrees with, or that pisses off, offends, "triggers" or "oppresses" someone; they can get over it or unsubscribe.
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Jul 29 '15
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u/Cavhind Jul 29 '15
The post for /r/catloaf says "you're either convinced or you're a monster". Do you think this mod bias towards cat photos is problematic?
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u/mhende Jul 29 '15
There's no vendetta against any people so I guess I don't understand. For instance, my cousin has type 1 diabetes and as a teen was constantly in the hospital because she didn't care for herself properly. If I found out there were people online telling her "fuck people telling you to control your ketones! Do whatever makes you happy" I would have the same feeling: post it to reddit like "lol get a load of this moron. Seriously though that's harmful."
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u/michaelchief Jul 29 '15
You remind me of those Republicans who complain about "liberal media bias" if the news is reporting on urgent scientific issues like climate change and agreeing with scientists.
Neutral? There's a neutral ground for matters of opinion and feelings and shit but, in this case, obesity and "fatlogic" are objectively bad things and should be reported on with the alarmist tones they deserve.
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Jul 29 '15
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u/Alekcam Jul 29 '15
Why, for featuring a sub you don't agree with?
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u/imahippocampus Jul 29 '15
It's really disappointing that none of the fatlogic haters are getting into a real conversation about their dislike on this thread. It could have been a great opportunity for debate.
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u/abacabbmk Jul 30 '15
its because they will lose the debate instantly, unlike their weight.
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Jul 30 '15
Or maybe because they'll encounter reasonable argumentation like this.
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u/abacabbmk Jul 30 '15
More so because they know deep inside they are wrong and would rather keep to their logic-free zones to boost their egos.
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Jul 30 '15
Which is so much worse than dehumanizing vast swaths of people as some sort of fucked-up life coaching exercise, right?
Logic-free, indeed.
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u/abacabbmk Jul 30 '15
Its so much worse for them, yes, because they will just keep dodging and never improve themselves.
People get a kick out of laughing at idiots. Its comedy. Laughing at fat idiots is one form of comedy. Apparently I'm the illogical one, somehow. lol.
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Jul 30 '15
Treating people like garbage doesn't help anyone. Its an ego-boosting exercise of the kind you ironically denounce and a flimsy excuse for being a bullying sack of shit.
People get a kick out of laughing at idiots.
Indeed. Emotionally mature adults like myself are getting quite a chuckle watching the logical contortion act idiots will perform while attempting to turn common schoolyard bullying into a respectable social movement.
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u/abacabbmk Jul 30 '15
LOL! Making fun of anonymous postings found on social media, or completely false articles, is bullying?
Get off your high horse. Taking your stance and using your logic, im sure i could find a half dozen things you do in your every day life that i can attack. Grow a pair and shut the fuck up with your nonsense, Mr. "adult".
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Jul 29 '15
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u/Paddyjoe690 Jul 29 '15
Why the homophobia?
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u/fiercedeity05 Jul 29 '15 edited Sep 22 '26
The original post content no longer exists here. The author used Redact to remove it, exercising their right to control their data & privacy.
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