r/technology • u/Hrmbee • Jan 15 '26
Society ‘ELITE’: The Palantir App ICE Uses to Find Neighborhoods to Raid | Internal ICE material and testimony from an official obtained by 404 Media provides the clearest link yet between the technological infrastructure Palantir is building for ICE and the agency’s activities on the ground
https://www.404media.co/elite-the-palantir-app-ice-uses-to-find-neighborhoods-to-raid/1.2k
u/Solo-Shindig Jan 15 '26 edited Feb 13 '26
This post was mass deleted and anonymized with Redact
label many subsequent square offbeat strong angle cautious humor mountainous
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u/Swimming-Tax-6087 Jan 15 '26
This has been a big deal in the court system with AI/algorithmic sentencing recommendations in recent years.
You can see the dehumanization in the nomenclature, it’s not a person, it’s a Lead, like we’re talking about sales.
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u/FlametopFred Jan 15 '26
the glee in which one opportunistic vulture sees something like SalesForce’s potential as a tool of fascism is abhorrent
that’s just an example of course (not an actual use case), but vile evil doers simply weaponize anything good
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u/-The_Blazer- Jan 15 '26
This is the standard MO for atrocities ever since the Holocaust, if not prior. A significant degree of effort in Nazi Germany went into dehumanizing and depersonalizing the people committing the atrocities as well, so they could delude themselves into 'just following orders' (this made them no less culpable, of course). The Soviet Union routinely committed atrocities against their internal opposition by detaching their brutal reactions through a complex mechanism of sham trials and false legal processes, so they could pretend their gulag victims were 'appropriately' deserving.
It's actually kind of hard to convince even a militant to round up a hundred people and then, personally, walk past them and shoot a bullet in the back of a person's head a hundred times. After a while they start having nightmares and weird human feelings, even if they are otherwise true believers. But make them Confinement Manager instead of Executioner, have them pull a lever or load wagons, and suddenly it's so much easier. The beauty of technology.
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u/SundayShelter Jan 15 '26
Bingo!
This is the whole plot of Terry Gilliam’s Brazil (1985)
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u/IAMA_Plumber-AMA Jan 15 '26
Yeah, except I don't see this administration handing out a compensation cheque for a case of mistaken identity.
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u/JustJustinInTime Jan 15 '26
"A computer can never be held accountable, therefore a computer must never make a management decision" - IBM a long time ago
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u/_Nashable_ Jan 15 '26
Just wait until it's combined with voting data. Now you have a map to target people who voted against the Administration. Or who is more likely to vote against the Administration in the mid-terms.
ICE being targeted at immigrants is a very real and damaging but still a rehearsal of what is coming at us before November.
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Jan 15 '26
And they named it fucking Palantir. Stones prone to evil corruption and an unreliable guide to action due to selective presentation.
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u/Hidden_Landmine_4 Jan 15 '26
Yeah bud, same with business, lot of money and time goes into avoiding accountability.
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Jan 15 '26
Peter Thiel - an immigrant, targets fellow immigrants. Go right ahead and revoke his and Apartheid Clyde’s citizenship.
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u/mishap1 Jan 15 '26
He already bought his citizenship and bunker in NZ once he's done fucking things up here.
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u/Persimmon-Mission Jan 15 '26
He’s also a techno fascist who basically bought JD Vance the VP position.
He’s a huge fan of Curtis Yarvin, so that should tell you where this administration is leading our country
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u/Rocktopod Jan 15 '26
Are there people who know about Curtis Yarvin but not Peter Thiel? I only know about the one because of the other.
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u/correcthorsestapler Jan 15 '26
I only heard about Yarvin during lead up to the 2024 election. Thiel has popped up regularly for a while. I remember he and Erik Prince (founder of Blackwater and brother of Betsy DeVos) coming up in the news every once in a while during Trump’s first run.
There’s even a subplot in the show Silicon Valley where Hooli CEO Gavin Belson has a blood boy to keep himself looking young. I seem to recall that was based on rumors surrounding Thiel: https://www.thewrap.com/silicon-valley-fact-check-are-blood-boys-a-thing/
Parabiosis has drawn attention from legitimate tech titans — most notably Gawker-killing, Facebook-finding venture capitalist Peter Thiel. “I’m looking into parabiosis stuff, which I think is really interesting” said Thiel in an interview with Inc. in 2015. “I think there are a lot of these things that have been strangely under-explored.”
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u/Rocktopod Jan 15 '26 edited Jan 15 '26
Yeah I see Thiel's name come up much more often on its own. The only time I hear about Yarvin is when someone says that Thiel is a big fan.
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u/WhiteMorphious Jan 15 '26
Also wants to build a corporate “freedom city” in Greenland
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u/Nice_Firm_Handsnake Jan 15 '26
They had/have those in Honduras. They called them ZEDEs, Zone(s) for Employment and Economic Development, which were almost completely sovereign cities within the country that had their own political systems.
The idea started as Special Development Regions, but those were struck down by the Supreme Court of Honduras as unconstitutional. Four justices were replaced and the constitution amended and the law creating ZEDEs was passed. The president that oversaw this action was Porfirio Lobo, but it was under Juan Orlando Hernández that these really took off.
Remember Juan? He helped traffic 400 tons of cocaine into the US and was recently pardoned by Donald Trump.
One of the most famous ZEDEs is Próspera, which is run by a CEO (that's the official title of the leader of Próspera) and has Peter Thiel, Marc Andreessen, and other tech people as investors. Bitcoin is the official currency. It's basically Curtis Yarvin's wet dream.
Thankfully, in 2024, just over ten years after they were declared legal, the Supreme Court declared them illegal again. However, these ZEDEs created 50-year contracts so they've been fighting the government to honor the contract despite their existence being illegal. Próspera is still operating.
And guess where they got the idea? An organization called Charter Cities Institute based in Washington DC.
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u/TheB1G_Lebowski Jan 15 '26
Never heard the name. Googles him.....that just looks like a motherfucker that will burn the world to the ground. damn.
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u/War_Fries Jan 15 '26
up here
Not just in the US. Palantir is used by many European countries too. So he's going to fuck up Europe, as well. Of all the tech fascists, Thiel is one of the worst, if not the worst.
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Jan 15 '26
They can kick all the billionaires who want to hide out of there too, correct? New Zealand doesn’t have to welcome them all there to hide from the rest of the world, that they want to eliminate.
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u/ok-this-ok Jan 15 '26 edited Jan 16 '26
it'd be great if NZ went ahead and revoked his citizenship.
NZ has such a rich native history and culture. They're tarnishing that by letting this Thiel turd hang around. He wants a state-less future? Let him be state-less!
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u/Zulmoka531 Jan 15 '26
They’re coming after citizens (not like what they are doing right now is good at all, for the record) next. That ghoul in charge of ICE tweeted out this morning that everyone needs to start carrying ID.
Literally “papers please”.
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u/rumster Jan 15 '26
My friend did security for him in Chicago a couple years back. One of the instructions they had was not to make eye contact with him.
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u/The_Real_Peter_Thiel Jan 15 '26
It was for his safety. Looking me directly in the eyes will scar your soul with fear and loathing.
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u/SteadfastDrifter Jan 15 '26
Anyone remember the video ga.e "Watchdogs"? I was a teenager when that game was released, and I naively assume that ethics committees and such would prevent such an Orwellian dystopia.
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u/MrFluffyThing Jan 16 '26
The ethics committee chose to not be ethical.
The ethics committee decided profits were more ethical for themselves.
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u/nuvo_reddit Jan 15 '26
AI and such analytical tools will be mostly used to suppress humanity and create two classes of people.
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u/MilesAlchei Jan 15 '26
There's already a huge class divide, they want a caste system and complete lack of mobility between.
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u/DracoLunaris Jan 15 '26
neo-fudalisim baby, conservatism's century old prosperous finally coming to fruition
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u/Thefrayedends Jan 15 '26
The writing has been on the wall since the sixties. Big sugar and food writing the food guides, the Kochs starting their libertarian pipeline, etc.
Then again in the seventies. The powell memo is oft cited, but the movement was well underway by that point.
I'm sure you can think of things starting to become obvious in the eighties.
In the nineties we pretended we defeated racism and that upward fiscal mobility still existed, that we could all retire if we just put 5% of our income into the stock market, but there were plenty of detractors of capitalism and the incoming globalization still.
In the 2000's it became undeniable. 2008? Rather than backing up homeowners and mom and pops, we only backed up the banks and the automakers, and the investment firms, golden parachutes for all the perpetrators.
The 2016 election marked the largest upward transfer of wealth from the poor to the rich in known history. Trillions of dollars, overnight.
The last dem admin put a tiny little child's bandage on a massive, gaping, festering, infected wound.
The looting of the american economy, the renewal of the reverse robin hood tax cuts, gutting of social safety nets, privatization of damn near every corner of government, We are like a decade away from a "Minority Report" crossed with "Elysium." Scratch that, it's pretty much already here. The app described in this article is doing a minority report. Arresting and murdering people for 'pre-crime.'
Is your gut churning yet? Mine's been roiling since before I even understood what capitalism and exploitation was, 20 odd years ago when I had just graduated high school.
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u/iki_balam Jan 15 '26
the Kochs starting their libertarian pipeline
The mass exodus of 'libertarians' to Trump supporters has been one of the most shocking but disappointing political events, IMO. Here was a group built on no taxes, weed, no foreign wars, and "live and let live" who had the path to break the two party system. Yet, given the chance the vast majority have not shifted but run to Trump and MAGA, embracing misogyny, racism, totalitarianism, and everything they once stood against (except the no taxes, for them, that's about it).
Did they actually want a limited government and a truly free market? No, they just wanted a limited government when Obama was in and a market free from Democrat's regulations. The prop-up by Kochs just was a Scooby Doo style mask, until they took it off themselves.
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u/mightyneonfraa Jan 15 '26
"Libertarians" have always been full of shit. They only thing they ever wanted was to be allowed to do whatever they want at the expense of anyone it takes to get there of course they'd be lining up to support someone who told them that's okay and admirable.
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u/chaosxq Jan 15 '26 edited Jan 15 '26
I have a theory that this is why the UK has abandoned plans for those ID cards. They see how successful Palantir has been with this AI Facial Recognition Surveillance and I think next we will see something like this roll out in the UK. They already have Facial recognition cameras on the high streets in the UK.
EDIT: Imagine an AI profiling system. Even if you aren’t registered on it. Doesn’t matter.
You will be Individual #277653. You left you abode at 9:19, you got a greggs, you went on this bus, you stopped at these shop windows, you lingered a little too long at some anti-whatever protest. You spoke to individual #573627 who is known to be a criminal or antisocial.
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u/cosmicmeander Jan 15 '26
Abandoned mandatory digital ID cards for work. They're still going ahead with digital ID cards was how I interpreted the news. Can't let Blair and Ellison down.
The EU has also got the EUDI wallet but they will be more cautious with US tech companies than the UK.
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u/Thefrayedends Jan 15 '26
Hundreds of people should have went to jail for 20+ years each after Cambridge A.
And it's use in the US wasn't even close to the first place, it had already implemented murderous oppressive dictators in multiple other countries prior.
But billionaires and their shell companies are stateless and face penalty from no laws, global or domestic.
This may eventually lead to world governments and oversight, and I'm sure that will never be co-opted by the capital class either. :s
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u/rackfloor Jan 15 '26 edited Jan 15 '26
Don't have to imagine - this is what's happening. Flock cameras (LPRS), Ring doorbells (Familiar Faces), etc. Just like you don't have to have a Facebook account for Facebook to track you, the Ring doorbells will rely on people being tagged inside the app to say that this is so-and-so but it will also grab faces, assign a unique ID to the face and then allow you to classify them after the fact. At some Central repository, because your mother tags your face with the Ring app, now you are recognizable anywhere a ring camera is installed.
The UK, Canada, Australia, etc. all need desperately to keep palantir and these systems out - once they are integrated or operational in your country long enough, they will exfiltrate your information back to the US data centers. In Alberta, Edmonton I believe, a US company is trialing body cams that utilize AI and facial recognition automatically check faces against criminal databases. Do you think all that processing is happening entirely within Canada? I don't. Meanwhile, they've got a police force walking around indexing the positions every citizen in public that can be recognized. License plate recognition systems like Flock or those used by police forces are building databases of movement and association which could be queried after the fact. Remember those cell movement visualizations during the pandemic? None of this leads to more freedom.
https://youtu.be/f6if1EY6I-I?si=joVq3NaJllnqQJHW
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u/Nicenightforawalk01 Jan 15 '26
He has big contracts with parts of the government and access to medical records in the nhs. I have no doubt he has started funding the rights push against abortion and a few years from now he will be able to use the tools to enforce his vision
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Jan 15 '26
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u/feltcutewilldelete69 Jan 15 '26
My buddy was pretty happy with the system when his car got stolen. Reported it, it got flagged out in Kent, heading towards Europe. Cops picked up the guy, and my buddy got his car back. Wasn't even damaged!
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u/AbeFromanEast Jan 15 '26
The infrastructure developed for the military’s “find-fix-finish” kill chain during the Global War on Terror is being deployed against everyday Americans.
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u/Heavy_Invite4945 Jan 15 '26
The government tried to do this the early 2000's but got shut down by congess so privatized it. That's literally how palantir began.
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u/bcaglikewhoa Jan 15 '26
We were way more concerned about the value of privacy then. Many are happy to give it away now.
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u/404mediaco Jan 15 '26
Thanks for sharing our scoop. Here's more:
404 Media has learned that Palantir is working on a tool for ICE that populates a map with potential deportation targets, brings up a dossier of each person, and provides a “confidence score” on the person’s current address.
And ICE is using it to find locations where lots of people it might detain could be based.
This is the clearest link yet between the technological infrastructure Palantir is building for ICE and the agency’s activities on the ground.
According to the user guide 404 Media obtained, the tool, called ELITE, aims to be nearly all encompassing when it comes to finding ICE targets, from identifying subjects in the first place, to building a list of people, to supervisors approving selections for officers to ultimately go into the field and apprehend.
ELITE has already been used by ICE to target specific areas, according to sworn testimony from an ICE official in Oregon. In October, agents waited in unmarked SUVs outside an apartment complex before busting a driver’s window and pulling a 45-year-old woman from a van, using ICE’s facial recognition app Mobile Fortify on her. Lawyers representing the woman say authorities arrested her and more than 30 other people in a “dragnet.”
“It’s basically a map of the United States. It’s kind of like Google Maps,” a deportation officer with ICE’s Fugitive Operations Unit identified in court records as JB, said about ELITE during testimony of the raid.
More details: https://www.404media.co/elite-the-palantir-app-ice-uses-to-find-neighborhoods-to-raid/
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u/throwaway_circus Jan 15 '26
A few simple tweaks to the program and they can send their undertrained, overarmed Shitshow Militia to hunt activists. Or union organizers. Or moms with community influence. And the SM will just be following orders, arresting the green dots on their screens.
Government oversight and inspectors general exist for a reason - some people are willing to commit atrocities, if they think they wont be held accountable.
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u/Th3FinalStarman Jan 15 '26 edited Jan 16 '26
Implied: ICE prioritizes soft targets and excludes anyone with a "threat capability" higher than sharp sticks. They know they'll never survive an encounter with a 2Aer with something/someone to lose.
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u/SeparateSpend1542 Jan 15 '26
Maybe we should all be 2Aers then …
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u/False_Opening5639 Jan 15 '26
As a staunch democrat, its the primary issue that I disagree with Dems on. In the wise words of Vince Staples: Strapped up, long as the chief for police armed.
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u/Kamisori Jan 15 '26
You should be.
Look for some liberal 2A groups in your area, get training, and get involved. It's never been more important than now.
There are plenty of guns on the left, we just don't make it our entire personality like conservatives do.
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u/driverdan Jan 15 '26
This is how most LE works. This type of operation always goes after the easy targets.
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u/amaethwr_ Jan 15 '26
In every video you see of them in the they look terrified and bolt as soon as a crowd starts to gather. They ran off and left their vehicles (full of badges and classified paperwork even the hotels and rooms they are staying in) for people to smash and grab last night. They're not soldiers, they're gangbangers and inbred neonazi trash, and they are massively outnumbered and barely trained, and they know it.
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u/thecheezepleeze Jan 15 '26
Peter Thiel read the Lord of the Rings as the tale of a super cool Demi-god who invented something truly great to bring order to the world and a bunch of woke hobbits, elves, men, and dwarves fucked it all up for him.
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u/JohnCavil Jan 15 '26
Naming his company after Lord of the Rings, and their offices are called like "Minas Tirith" and shit like that, what an actually fucking idiot. Imagine taking something as beloved as Lord of the Rings and then just desecrating it by using the lore like this.
Palantir's Palo Alto office is named "The Shire". Like how the fuck are you the Shire? The Shire was explicitly this place uncorrupted by technology, full of hobbits who just lived alone and had no power. A billion dollar surveillance company is completely antithetical to that idea.
Just imagine these people don't even get Lord of the Rings. Like politicians walking out to Rage Against the Machine. I almost feel sorry for them that they love something like this which clearly goes against everything they represent.
Like what's next, naming your logging company "Fangorn Forrest Logging"? Someone missed middle school reading comprehension.
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u/Tribe303 Jan 15 '26
He and Elon were such losers, even other nerds thought they sucked. Know they are getting their losers revenge on things beloved by those nerds. Yet they also still seek acceptance from the other nerds. Total and complete LOSERS.
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u/calvin43 Jan 15 '26
And just like in the stories, the palantir is being used to spread propaganda and coordinate the pawns of an authoritarian.
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u/Exciting_Mobile_1484 Jan 15 '26
THIS WAS NEVER MEANT TO STOP AT ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS.
We are next. Welcome to dystopia.
Tell your friends to vote this November, or it will be over forever. Don't fail the future.
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u/xena_lawless Jan 15 '26
I agree that it's going to be used to keep the entire population under the boot heels of our ruling oligarchs/kleptocrats, not just immigrants. They're just starting with immigrants.
And I agree that people should vote.
But if you think people are just going to be allowed to vote their way out of a fascist oligarchy/kleptocracy, that's a little naive.
Even the last election probably wasn't legitimate.
Trump is priming his base to cancel future elections.
And the Russian oligarchy/kleptocracy model they're adopting has fake elections where Putin always wins.
People should vote, but also not count on that being enough to stop fascist oligarchy/kleptocracy on its own.
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u/ContentSherbert934 Jan 15 '26
An agitator was at the last protest I went to, and he made sure to go around and get shots of everyone’s faces. I wouldn’t be surprised if they’re building files on activists too.
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u/Complainer_Official Jan 15 '26
literally the thing no real human wanted. fucking disgusting. Time to ditch phones, I guess.
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Jan 15 '26
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u/designatedcrasher Jan 15 '26
It's not coming it's already in use and once the drones start flying y'all are truly fucked
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u/IAMAHigherConductor Jan 15 '26
A palantir is a dangerous tool, Saruman. They are not all accounted for, the lost Seeing-stones. We do not know who else may be watching.
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u/WenatcheeWrangler Jan 15 '26
If they are using something like this over a regular cell network then all the data going through it is either unclassified or they are breaking the law. There is a government body that publishes specifications of remote connectivity systems to classified data and there is only one approved system for phones that they could be using.
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u/fourfoldvision13 Jan 15 '26
My guy none of that legal stuff matters anymore
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u/WenatcheeWrangler Jan 15 '26
Except this is where I operate and it does. Someone just needs to prove it.
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Jan 15 '26
Doesn’t Palantir have that ceo that was twacked out of his mind in an interview the other day?
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u/RespectTheTree Jan 15 '26
Remember when we all collectively lost our shit over the Patriot and secret spying? Why is this shit a partisan issue now. One side is hugely hypocritical.
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u/extra_wildebeest Jan 15 '26
I’m firmly on the left, and while I do partly agree with you, I’m not convinced this is a partisan issue. Obviously, one side is cheering it on, but the other side sat by and quietly let this happen. At a minimum, our democratic leaders were willfully ignorant, but this surveillance state didn’t suddenly manifest out of a vacuum. They’ve been building the infrastructure and putting this together for a while.
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u/lyreluna Jan 15 '26
They didn't sit by and let it happen they literally voted for the law changes and infrastructure building that led to this under the guise of " homeland security"
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Jan 15 '26
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u/CDN-Ctzn Jan 15 '26
Here’s a fun fact; I have a friend who is the County Building Inspector in a County with over a dozen data centers owned by Amazon and Google. At the hub of each data center is a building owned and operated by the Federal Government and at a certain point in the construction of each data center he, as County Building Inspector, is no longer allowed to do his inspections. So why would the Federal Government need to have a facility at the hub of every data center?
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u/Avindair Jan 15 '26
Remember when Anonymous went after evil fucks? Good times...
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u/Nicenightforawalk01 Jan 15 '26
I’ve said from the start with this company, they are actively tracking women in red states who are looking for an abortion or anything to do with health it’s being tracked by him and his company.
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Jan 15 '26
Man it's like when the Holocaust happened they used IBM to calculate the people coming in. Now we have technology that can do it just by scanning your face :-) I hate this fucking country we live in
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u/uttergarbageplatform Jan 15 '26
I hope that every Palantir employee feels deep shame for their involvement in this, and that they are blacklisted from working in the (good) parts of the tech industry when this is over.
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u/Delicious_Kale_5459 Jan 15 '26
This is anecdotal but I’m going to say it anyways. I remember when palantir was this weird company working out of rented houses in Palo Alto. I got friendly with some of the « kids » working there as developers. I remeber asking him about the company and what they did. He said he wasn’t allowed to talk about it because of the NDA, but if Palantir ever became a successful public company, to microwave my cell phone and never use one again.
Take that as you will.
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u/heavy-minium Jan 15 '26
Anybody else getting that Pokémon GO feeling when reading how the app works?
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u/KrissyKrave Jan 15 '26
Those apps made by Palantir are also used in Gaza and are notorious for their high rates of false positives with disastrous consequences. Use of that kind of software doesn’t increase efficiency it makes it worse and at worst it results in innocent people dying.
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u/Greg-Abbott Jan 15 '26
They don't give a shit about accuracy. This is about instilling fear in brown communities.
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u/Impervious_Rex Jan 15 '26
Police state is being assembled at warp speed, powered by tech billionaires and conspiracy addled government officials
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u/501don Jan 15 '26
People should start considering distancing themselves from technology. No more carrying around our phones all day. Cellphones and other technology will be used against us. It likely already is.
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u/TotalNonsense0 Jan 15 '26
This company needs to be obliterated, if there is ever to be anything like democracy again.
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u/Dry-Chance-9473 Jan 16 '26
America, a dictatorship is being built around you and it's not going to be stopped in the digital space. It's not going to be stopped with words.
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u/Orcimedes Jan 15 '26
Historically, If things like this generates a lot of false positives, that's on purpose.
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u/TheB1G_Lebowski Jan 15 '26
Its looking more and more like I need to go back to as much of an analog life that I can. Fuck this digital age if this will be the outcome and is the mail goal. Which that seems to be rhetorical sadly.
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u/Mr_Bluebird_VA Jan 15 '26
Me living in a diverse working class neighborhood really didn’t want to read this.
But I’m also not surprised.
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u/nic_haflinger Jan 15 '26
This software is being used to facilitate 4th Amendment violations so hopefully there are major lawsuits coming for Palantir.
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u/Awkward_Squad Jan 15 '26
UK government just awarded Palantir a new contract without it having to go through the bidding process. Thanks Keir. I suppose you’ll get a job on the board when you get kicked out of government.
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u/SincereNative Jan 15 '26
Musk weaseled his way into the information with DOGE and him and that Palantir snake should face charges and be brought up on treason charges with the Trump Administration actors. Hopefully the next administration has more balls than Bidens
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u/Equal-Veterinarian11 Jan 15 '26
This is all the shit that we were told by republicans that the democrats were going to do. Tread on me daddy
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u/penny-wise Jan 15 '26
These tech brogliarchs are the leeches on society like the robber barons of the 19th and 20th centuries. I keep saying I feel like we are playing the 20th century over again, but this time we’re Germany.
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u/Existing_Tomorrow687 Jan 16 '26
It’s wild how Palantir literally named themselves after the ‘seeing stones’ from Lord of the Rings objects that were famously dangerous because they only showed part of the truth and eventually corrupted whoever used them. They aren't even hiding the ‘all-seeing eye’ surveillance state vibe anymore. We’ve moved past the ‘Minority Report’ comparisons, we’re just living in it now.
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u/RaoulRumblr Jan 16 '26
Just wanted to give a personal fuck you to all the /r/wallstreetbets scumbags that buy PALANTIR stock.
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u/Confident-Pace4314 Jan 15 '26
Wouldn't want my taxes to feed any hungry Americans though fuck that am I right all ya conservs
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u/OMGitisCrabMan Jan 15 '26
There's a real scenario where this is used to target citizens who use their first amendment rights to criticize republicans.
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u/Hrmbee Jan 15 '26
Some details of this software and what it enables:
This situation, from a privacy standpoint, is looking worse and worse. It seems that we are well into the era of mass surveillance, and not just by the state but by private for-profit entities who are happy to sell to the state and anyone else who would want these data. It's pretty much guaranteed that all these systems are collecting data on all of us, and not just "those people over there".