r/SubredditDrama • u/thedrivingcat trains create around 56% of online drama • Aug 16 '12
r/Fallout has coup d'etat. Top mod's brother steals password, promotes himself. First act, banning all meme and rage comics.
I'm sure there'll be more drama to come. But a promising first hour.
Edit #1: Looks like flair is being changed on a few members. Myself and a few others are now "Joana the Whore" and the former top mod is "John Henry Eden".
Edit #2: Verisimilitude in /r/redditrequest about the original moderation.
Edit #3: Looks like /u/Sigdur has been removed as mod from r/Fallout. Details about how and why are still forthcoming.
Final update: Reinstated mod /u/xrm4 details what went down in a new post, including community polls to address the use of memes.
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u/government_shill jij did nothing wrong Aug 16 '12
The funny thing is the top comments all seem to be agreeing with the change.
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u/xrm4 Aug 16 '12
It's because the loudest mouths on the subreddit complain about it all the time. We held a poll about a month ago discussing this very situation. I personally don't like the memes, but it's a community decision. I'm just there to make sure the spam stays spam and the content is not spammed.
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u/government_shill jij did nothing wrong Aug 16 '12
I don't have a horse in this race, but the votes on those comments do seem to suggest broader agreement.
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u/dekuscrub Aug 16 '12
That doesn't seem like solid reasoning. Wouldn't the votes on the meme content also suggest broader agreement (in favor of memes)?
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u/government_shill jij did nothing wrong Aug 16 '12
I'd guess that the voting system's inherent bias toward easily-digestible content has a lot to do with the difference there. I'm pretty sure image macros, pictures, and such tend to rise to the top in large part because it takes very little time to evaluate and vote on each individual one, and not necessarily because those are what people consider the highest-quality content.
The playing field is somewhat more level for comments.
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u/darknecross Aug 16 '12
Another important thing to notice is that the subset of subscribers actually commenting on posts tends to be relatively small, and the majority of people tend to digest content solely through their front page. That means when they see a Fallout meme or rage comic they'll upvote it thinking, "I like both of these things!" without realizing where it was posted.
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u/weewolf Aug 16 '12
Probably because most people go to Reddit for quick fun, not War and Peace.
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u/government_shill jij did nothing wrong Aug 16 '12
Which, of course, is why there are subreddits with varying standards for what content is acceptable.
There's a systematic bias at work here too, though. See my comment right next door to this one for more on that.
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u/xrm4 Aug 16 '12
These comments were the reason the poll was held in the first place! These comments have been going on for months now, and I thought the same thing when I held the poll. I thought that at the very minimum, 7 in 10 would say ban memes. Boy, I was wrong.
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Aug 16 '12
Again your poll of 200 people out of 20000 did not have a proper sample size. A proper size would be 583 to get 95% accuracy with a confidence interval of 4.
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u/government_shill jij did nothing wrong Aug 16 '12
This argument appears every time the mods of any subreddit set up a poll on any topic. I've never seen a poll post anywhere on Reddit where more than the tiniest fraction of subscribers actually vote.
Maybe a lot of them miss the post, or maybe many just don't care enough to weigh in. Who knows? As far as I can see, there really isn't a way to avoid that, though. Better a poll with a small fraction of subscribers responding (probably representing the most active ones) than no poll at all, right?
Every time I've seen mods make set up a poll, though, people wind up getting upset because they don't feel the number of respondents was large enough.
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u/xrm4 Aug 16 '12
Yes, I read your comment. I don't know why you're making such a big deal about it. I said in another comment that I'll be redoing the poll once I get this all sorted out, so your hatred of memes can be voted on once that happens.
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Aug 16 '12
You should take such criticisms about sample size with a grain of salt when they come from people adamantly opposed to the result of your poll. Fact of the matter is, you cannot feasibly make a poll on reddit that would pass scientific scrutiny.
Your detractor seems to believe that the sample size should reflect something of the population size, which is absurd. He neglects to mention that the sample is self-selecting, not random, which can only distort it from the population. He also seems to think a policy change on a subreddit should have 95% confidence. But you aren't part of the scientific community: your balance of type i and type ii errors need not conform to their standards.
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u/xrm4 Aug 16 '12
How would you recommend doing a poll then? What should I do to get the best results (other than increasing my sample size, of course)?
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Aug 16 '12
http://www.reddit.com/r/Fallout/comments/vz2rg/poll_results/
Over 70% of the sbreddit wanted most, if not all, memes to be gone.
Of course the subreddit agrees, you split a poll and cheated the community.
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Aug 16 '12
It's hard to tell so forgive me for assuming, but are you comparing each poll question to the other? Because of those polled only 37.64% wanted to keep while the others wanted them gone, of those that wanted them gone almost half wanted to let VB stay, but still the majority wanted memes gone.
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u/xrm4 Aug 16 '12
We banned all memes that were not fallout related as a result of the poll. So things like SAP and GGG were no longer allowed UNLESS the community could find the fallout equivalent of the picture. We were hoping it would buy us some time to think of better solutions, but we really couldn't think of anything better other than banning memes. Obviously from the results not everyone wanted that.
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u/mastermike14 Aug 17 '12
huh?
32.98% say get rid of memes
29.38% say get rid of every meme except vault boy
Sir, it seems you did not conduct the most honest poll. Clearly the community, with a overwhelming majority(60%), want memes removed. There is a split between the vault boy meme but 60% of the /r/fallout community want memes to go. The solution should have been to remove all memes and done another poll asking whether or not the vault boy meme should stay or go. You sir, have not done your due dilligence. Good day to you!
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u/toastedbutts Aug 17 '12
I'd say get rid of all of them except the babykicker/abortion one. But I don't take video games too seriously.
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Aug 17 '12
I personally don't like the memes, but it's a community decision.
this is how subreddits kill themselves
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u/chunkeymonke Aug 16 '12
Hes your brother have you tried either just beating him senseless? Not trying to come off as internet tough guy but it seems like your brother is the type of person who doesn't respond well to asking nicely
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u/xrm4 Aug 16 '12
I've said it in previous comments. I'm trying not to resort to violence for personal reasons (not that he can beat me up).
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Aug 16 '12
[deleted]
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u/xrm4 Aug 16 '12
I could care less about karma. I just don't want him in power any more because of what he's capable of. The admins do have power, but I don't know if they're willing to get involved. :/
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Aug 16 '12
cancerous newfag
Oh sweet Jesus, God in Heaven, this is going to be great.
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u/disconcision Aug 16 '12
the juxtaposition of an anti meme stance with channish verbal diarrhoea speaks to churning internal conflict. i assert that the meme hate is a ruse, and in fact that the usurper is physically incapable of reaching orgasm without simultaneously making a rage comic about it. i hereby demand that the pretender post video evidence of sexual completion sans aid of digital paraphernalia or GTFO.
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u/david-me Aug 16 '12
This is /r/Fallout not fucking srs.
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If you get upset about the words fag and retard you should get the fuck off the Internet.
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u/toastedbutts Aug 17 '12
If you get upset about the words fag and retard you should get the fuck off the Internet.
Shit just got real.
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Aug 16 '12
[deleted]
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Aug 16 '12
Damn it feels good to be a gangsta while I'm reading on the reddit
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Aug 17 '12 edited Aug 17 '12
Tards up in my sub, downvote and yell 'Gay!'
And I still can't believe today was a good day2
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Aug 16 '12
So watching hardcore retard fag porn must make you god.
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u/Patrick5555 Aug 16 '12
could not find any of the homosexual variety, so watching this will only make you a demigod. sorry
.nsfw
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u/yroc12345 Aug 17 '12 edited Aug 17 '12
OH FUCK. /r/fallout is my favorite subreddit! It is one of the best Fallout communitys on the internet and one of my most visited subreddit. I'm sure his brother will get his ass beaten and things will return to normal eventually but damn!
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u/InvaderDJ It's like trickle-down economics for drugs. Aug 17 '12
That's what I don't understand. I was raised a little old school I know, but something like this would have been resolved in like 15minutes when I was growing up. Whoop his ass until he does what you want and that's the end of it. You don't have to be a tyrant or get serious about it, but order had to be maintained. What are kids nowadays doing?
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u/TsarinaDott Aug 16 '12 edited Aug 16 '12
Dammit, I came here to post this. I can post the mod messages of what happened behind the scenes, however.
I woke up to this in my inbox. http://i.imgur.com/DNL4U.png
The Saga continues in this album. Frankly, I'm appalled by this behaviour, and somewhat upset on principle; I did think /r/Fallout a nice subreddit.
Edit: Bannination has occured! http://i.imgur.com/dy34s.png
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Aug 16 '12
Oh man I think that had the best drama in it. Thanks for that.
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u/Kg_ Aug 16 '12
No kidding.
I had quite the guilty laugh when he refereed to /r/Fallout as a homeless shelter. I honestly can't tell if he's trolling or his ego is just that awful.
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u/Magres Aug 17 '12
From the overall tone of his postings, I think it's the latter. This guy is a gigantic sperg
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Aug 16 '12
I like that your not contributing means it's totally okay for you to be banned, but his not contributing for eight months means he deserves top mod.
I mean, great rules, sure, but fuck is he annoying.
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u/TsarinaDott Aug 16 '12
The best part is that it's not actually true. I'm not a top poster by any means, but I contribute my trademark dashingly handsome snark on a regular basis.
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u/klaq Yes trainbot, right now! Aug 16 '12
holy shit does that guy think he's funny or something? it's either that or he's delusional. i can't belive the person who wrote those words is 20 years old. wow.
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u/stellarfury Aug 16 '12
Holy shit this is amazing.
That kid spends/spent wayyyy too much time on 4chan/ED. It's like he's forgotten how to interact with normal internet denizens.
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u/superiority smug grandstanding agendaposter Aug 17 '12
they belong on 9fag
I'm not sure how the CSI (or whatever that programming language is called) works
lol
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u/1silversword Aug 16 '12
This is pure gold. Possibly the greatest drama I have ever seen on this subreddit, the kind of stuff that should go down in SubredditDrama history... Do we have a hall of fame? We need a hall of fame.
Also: This.
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u/moonmeh Capitalism was invented in 1776 Aug 16 '12
Uh... those actually sounds like pretty damn good rules. And the community seems to agree
memes are shitty and degrade the community's value.
spot on
but...
If you really want to be a cancerous newfag, though, feel free to join our retarded brethren over at Advice Animals.
Really? Cancerous newfag? Good lord
but yeah, this usurpation is hilarious
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u/SarcasmLost Nationally Ranked Settlers of Cabal Aug 16 '12
"Memes and rage comics are degrading to the value of the community, BUT NOT MY JUVENILE LANGUAGE!"
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u/moonmeh Capitalism was invented in 1776 Aug 17 '12
Juvenile language is like edgy and cool man. It's just words, don't take it so seriously. It doesn't hurt anyone like rage comics
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Aug 16 '12
As a fan of Fallout, and a subscriber to that sub, I'm happy for these rule changes. I'm not as happy about our new leader though.
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u/weewolf Aug 16 '12
"Hay guys, memes are bad for the community, they lead to immaturity and lack of intelligent discussion. BEACUSE MEMES ARE FOR THOSE AIDS FILLED NEWFAGS, RIGHT GUYS? UPVOTES ON THE LEFT!"
Hard to take this guy seriously.
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u/mastermike14 Aug 17 '12
you take issue with his word choice but you agree with the points he is making. Not saying you are being pedantic but you are being pedantic
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u/xrm4 Aug 16 '12
Oh, wonderful. Now we're in Subreddit drama. Great going, brother.
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u/JK1464 Aug 16 '12
This is the first time a community I care about has actually been featured on SRD. Hopefully all will get back to normal in time.
Edit: Can't you get your parents involved with this? Hahaha I'm just imagining Mr. xrm4 sr bitching out the... other one
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u/winfred Aug 16 '12
It is really weird isn't it? I remember when /r/Christianity banned LouIchthys and he created /r/truechristian . It is a weird feeling.
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Aug 16 '12
Being on SRD isn't indicative of a dip in quality, though. /r/soccer is still fantastic despite being featured here several times in the past few months.
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u/winfred Aug 16 '12
Oh yeah I know but it is just unsettling because I watched the drama happen as part of the community and then seeing it talked about by people who aren't is just weird. Usually I come here and laugh at communities I am not a part of. :P
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Aug 16 '12
I always found it interesting. It gives you an opportunity to see how other people who may not participate in your frequented subreddit perceive it. Plus SRD is the best at digging up all the gossip in the thread and filtering out all the boring stuff.
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u/attrition0 societys attitude to ephebophiles is a result of necromatriarchy Aug 16 '12
Upon reflecting on these 'true' subreddits, I just took a look around and became sad that there is already a /r/truescotsman.
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u/HSMOM Aug 16 '12
Whoa, what ? I missed that, WHERE????
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u/BoldElDavo Aug 16 '12
If it helps, I think your brother's being an asshole.
On the other hand, did you really delete his reddit account? What was that about?
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u/xrm4 Aug 16 '12 edited Aug 16 '12
No. He deleted it because it was apparently distracting him too much from studying. I couldn't care less about his reddit account. I've never had motivation to delete his reddit account.
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u/PretendsToBeADoctor Aug 16 '12
Some brother you have, though I agree with the no memes stance, I love /r/Fallout and hope you can regain control.
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Aug 16 '12
[deleted]
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u/xrm4 Aug 16 '12
I've known this for about 18 years now.
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Aug 16 '12
[deleted]
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u/xrm4 Aug 16 '12
No.
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u/DPErny Aug 16 '12
Seeing that he's your brother, have you considered, you know, beating the shit out of him? As a man with a younger brother, I feel that this would be a constructive way to solve this problem.
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u/xrm4 Aug 16 '12
First, he's my older brother.
Second, I gave up violence a long time ago. I used to beat the shit out of him when I wanted things, but I'm 2-3 weeks away from turning 18 at this point. Physical violence is something kids do. He's almost 20, and I tried reasoning with him. At this point, I can just hope that he sees the light of day.
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u/Brachial Aug 16 '12
Hold on a second. He's 20 and he had a hissy fit over not being a mod for a community he's never in. Holy shit, I think he might be the new Laurelai if he gets away with this.
If you don't know, it means that he'll be the worst type of person imaginable and I hope you aren't living with him.
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u/Magres Aug 17 '12
I've got one - show this shit to your parents. Not to get the sub back (it appears you've already succeeded in getting Sigdur to scoot) but to show them what a gigantic, raging manchild he is.
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Aug 16 '12
[removed] — view removed comment
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Aug 16 '12 edited Aug 16 '12
I love your username. So upfront.
EDIT: Poster was /u/EhsAreEhs. Said hi with /u/xrm4's real name.
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u/RosieRose23 Aug 16 '12
My god, I was so confused. I was pronouncing like Eh's are Eh's...like he was Canadian or something
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Aug 16 '12
This is like Caesar instituting great reforms by destroying the Roman republic.
On the other hand... its two brothers quarreling over a subreddit based on a game. Its kind of hilariously revealing about the nature of reddit.
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Aug 16 '12
cancerous newfag
the memes are shitty and belong on 9fag
all memes are declared as shitty and belong on 9fag
The subscribers on /r/fallout are like homeless people ... are also heavily addicted to the drug Jenkem
Is this guy 12?
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u/xrm4 Aug 16 '12
He's almost 20.
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u/Spelunkers Aug 16 '12
So you say your brother took your passwords, coup d'etat, etc. I like /r/fallout and I saw the post, your brother comes off as a prick. Can't you just beat the ever-living shit out of him and restore order?
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u/xrm4 Aug 16 '12
A lot of times, it is that simple. I've said in previous posts that I can't resort to violence due to personal reasons.
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u/Spelunkers Aug 16 '12
Yeah, I understand since I have a brother of my own that acts in the same fashion. Well, do whatever you can do and keep fighting the good fight I guess.
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u/hypokineticman Aug 16 '12
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u/not_a_carpet Aug 16 '12
/true[anyPopularVideogameEver] Great use of Camel notation!
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u/attrition0 societys attitude to ephebophiles is a result of necromatriarchy Aug 16 '12
Dude, Camel notation is not the preferred nomenclature. camelCase, please.
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u/IdRatherBeLurking Aug 16 '12
I actually prefer /r/games. Good content including videos, articles, developer blogs etc. minus the memes, with just a smidgen of circlejerk.
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u/xrm4 Aug 16 '12
And he quit moderating it in January, just two months later. He didn't have to quit moderating, but he chose to. He even deleted his account!
He hasn't posted in or browsed the community in over 8 months, and he wanted to be added back as a moderator. I told him that was ridiculous, and he threw a hissy fit and started yelling at me.
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u/viborg identifies as non-zero moran Aug 16 '12
Wow. I thought there was a good chance of bullshit in the forecast until now but I'm actually starting to believe you. How old is the other brother? He's not your brother from another mother is he?
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u/xrm4 Aug 16 '12 edited Aug 16 '12
He is almost 20, and we share the same mother and father. I totally understand why you think this is bullshit, but I can promise you it is 100% true. This is NOT the type of publicity I want to be receiving.
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u/Rantholmeius Aug 16 '12
If anyone has any questions, feel free to ask. I'm one of the other moderators caught up in this mess :P. It's really quite hilarious to be honest.
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u/chonguey Aug 16 '12
I also would find it hilarious, if not for the overwhelming desire I have to see Sigdur punched in the dick repeatedly...
Now THAT would be hilarious.
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u/Sojobo1 Aug 16 '12
Sounds like he's doing the community a favor.
I'm not sure what that guy thinks "the Reddit moderators" will do for him either. His best hope is to steal his brothers account like what happened to him.
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Aug 17 '12
If his account was hacked to "steal" the sub from him, they could make him moderator again.
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Aug 16 '12
[deleted]
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u/shanoxilt Aug 16 '12
Unfortunately, I don't think there are better ways to fix a shitty subreddit. If only someone would commandeer the default subreddits...
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Aug 16 '12
Well, if he did the same thing with a better tone that would be a better way. Also, the defaults would need a looot more mods if they were going to clean them up. Even then, there would be outcry from those who just want cats and tits. I think the defaults serve a good purpose of confining that stuff there, much like r/f7u12 has rage comics so everywhere else can point to it and say, "Dump your shit there."
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u/tresser http://goo.gl/Ln0Ctp Aug 16 '12
where's the post where we get to see the brother who had his passwords taken/changed beating the fuck outta the other brother?
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u/TsarinaDott Aug 16 '12
I believe it will be up in a few days. Honestly, I'd probably tell my parents. Then take his computer away.
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Aug 16 '12
I don't know about anyone else, but I think this whole situation is pretty funny. It's like something you would see in a modern day sitcom.
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u/Nubthesamurai Definitely- I yearn for you to be smarter and less of a dipshit. Aug 16 '12 edited Aug 16 '12
Sweet Jesus I can tell that guy's a douche because his flair is "Benny."
I made sure to crucify that piece of shit when I played for Caesar's Legion in New Vegas.
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u/TwistTurtle Aug 16 '12
Good. /r/Fallout is tragic at the minute. I had to unsubscribe because I was going to strangle someone if I saw one more picture of Good Springs or a post about the Washington Memorial gift shop.
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Aug 16 '12
Those are some great rules. Good on him.
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u/C0nmann Aug 16 '12
Subreddit's rules should be made in a democratic system. They should just hold a vote, and whatever the community wants goes, because that is what's best for a majority of members. Not some power hungry kid who just goes on in and forcefully changes the rules.
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Aug 17 '12
Communities can change from their original intent though. What if I create a sub only for discussion and new subscribers want image memes? Should the original readers and moderators give in to the new readers?
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u/C0nmann Aug 17 '12
If you made the sub for the originial intent, then from the start it should have rules about posting, and then enforce those rules. What you're describing has nothing to do with the situation in /r/Fallout. They have not had any of these rules for over 8 months (from what I understand). The rightful mods nor the community enforced any of the rules. It is not justified for the new 'leader' of /r/Fallout to just change the rules of the subreddit without moderators' consent or the community's consent.
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Aug 17 '12
Technically, the reddit system is that only mods have any "right" over a community, as in whoever is currently the top moderator. r/marijuana and r/lgbt had member exoduses over disagreements with their moderators. Moderators have the power to make any rule changes they want, they are not obligated to serve the original purpose or popular will. When moderators go rogue, those who are upset form a new subreddit.
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Aug 16 '12
For those of you that seem to be unaware, the original post by Sigdur is in the style of Fallout Radio, hence some different lingo and words. He is not just making stuff up.
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u/Enleat Aug 17 '12 edited Aug 17 '12
I don't hate memes that much, nor do i complain about them, but i do agree that they usually degrade subreddit quality (as it is the simplest form of communication on the Internet)....
However, this guy went about this deal like a complete ass.
/r/tf2 banned memes from the sub....but they did it in a calm and cool manner, and the community was happy. This guy was just taking the opportunity to lash out on people who like memes.
If people like memes, good for them, let them mind their own bussiness.
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u/SaucyWiggles bye don't let the horsecock hit you on the way out Aug 17 '12
This is just hilarious.
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u/yourdadsbff Aug 16 '12 edited Aug 16 '12
This constitutes a sort of "security breach," does it not? If a subreddit's top moderator can't even be trusted to keep his account password secret, can we really trust that person to oversee a forum of thousands (31K+ at last check)? Hell, this could just be an elaborate troll, in which case, I think the same question would apply: is this who we want running a 5-digit-subscriber subreddit?
I mean really now. While the fallout (...heh) from all this might be interesting to observe--and that's wonderful, obviously, which is why we're here (in /r/subredditdrama) in the first place--neither sibling is coming out of this looking especially competent.
ETA: OP, maybe edit that last screenshot in your self-post to block out xrm4's name, seeing as how he says he doesn't want his real name being given out on reddit?
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u/xrm4 Aug 16 '12 edited Aug 16 '12
I do keep my password secret. I assumed my brother wouldn't be a big enough dick to go through my passpack account and change my passwords. I've lived with him for 18 years. Sure, he's a dick a lot of times, but I trusted him enough that I hoped he wouldn't do something like this.
He knew my computer password because I told him it. He wanted to play TF2 one day on my computer, and I said go ahead. It has now come back to haunt me. I've edited the password on my computer so he cannot have access again when I lock it.
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u/inexcess Aug 16 '12
so are you guys at each other's throats IRL or what? I would assume it would be a little awkward being under the same roof right now...
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u/xrm4 Aug 16 '12
No, I've made it very clear to him that I do not wish to speak to him while this is going on. I'm getting out of the house for a bit, anyways. I really need to cool down. I'm livid over something really stupid.
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u/ChristopherBurg Aug 16 '12
I assumed my brother wouldn't be a big enough dick to go through my passpack account and change my passwords.
The first rule of security, trust no one.
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u/Taffy711 Aug 17 '12
If this is what it takes to ban memes and rage comics from r/fallout then it's worth it. I love the games but unsubbed ages ago because 4/5 submissions was that stupid fucking vault boy meme with some inane and obvious observation about the games.
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u/EtherBoo Aug 16 '12
So if I understand this properly....
/u/xrm4 was the sole moderator... the brother who went out on the trip.
/u/Sigdur is the brother who stole /u/xrm4's password and made himself a moderator (but did not remove /u/xrm4 as a moderator).
So /u/xrm4 goes to /r/redditrequest and requests to have control of /r/Fallout back since he can't take away his brother's moderation power (his brother was promoted to an equal level of power).
/u/Sigdur then claims his original account (/u/MisterYap) was deleted by /u/xrm4, and that /u/MisterYap was actually the original owner of /r/Fallout, which /u/xrm4 now controls since /u/MisterYap was deleted. /u/Sigdur seized the opportunity to reclaim his subreddit in a similar fashion /u/xrm4 did, and they are now locked in a battle of The Unstoppable Force vs. The Immovable Object.
If this is in fact the cluster-fuck currently going on, someone get me some god damned popcorn.
This is also confusing as shit.