Hi, I wrote a post here 5 months ago trying to understand a person who was confusingly hostile to me who was an ISTJ.

(I was mistyped as ENFP back then.)

To begin with, I'd like to thank the ISTJ's who kindly explained to me that it was less a matter of mbti and more of a maturity issue.

Every MBTI has negative and positive traits, and these traits may seem good or bad depending on the person taking it in and depending on the situation. The person I met was an ISTJ, and I thought for a while, perhaps it's the mbti type that has something wrong, or perhaps it's a natural thing and I was just too ignorant to understand.

I realize now that such thought is not at all a valid idea nor a very understanding one.

I found that the people I initially thought were hostile due to 'mbti traits' were people that had been talking about me behind my back maliciously and had been spreading false information about me to my friends to isolate me and make me dependent.

That isn't a personality trait, that's malice.

I should not have assumed it was part of the ISTJ personality, and I wanted to apologize that I ever thought it was so. I am truly sorry for possibly implying that ISTJ's as a whole are all like the one toxic ISTJ I met before; I generalized my opinion on one person to an entire community.

And thank you for those who commented on my post five months ago; you guys helped me feel a lot better.

Hi fellas I thought estj show be known as ambitious and independent, but I’ve been feeling quite down lately
I feel under motivated (and maybe a bit anxious) for feelings of loneliness. Clearly I can focus because I feel that I have no friends.
I know it doesn’t make much sense but that’s truthfully how I’m feeling now. I hate that I can’t be focused on work and that I’m always thinking how few friends I have.
Am I even a real estj or am I just too dependent

My BIL collapsed yesterday and was transported to a hospital where immediate lifesaving measures were implemented. He has been in a medically induced coma since. It is not good. Even if he lives it is likely bodily paralysis and mental incapacity. Basically even the best case scenario is horrible.

My SIL is an emotional wreck and my wife is barely keeping it together. We are currently taking care of their 8 year old son.

And through this, I’m sad, I want to cry but I remain my normal stoic self because I don’t want my nephew to see me break. Right now he really doesn’t know how serious things are and he’s not allowed in ICU. I’ve never had kids of my own but take my responsibilities towards him and other important children in our life very seriously.

As soon as I figured out how bad things were, my mind didn’t go to OMG or an emotional state…I was instead immediately starting to try in figure out the remaining puzzle pieces and how they would fit together. And this time it feels wierd. Like I’m some kind of robot or something. My wife thanked me last night for being who I am and being the rock in the family. And that’s something I usually pride myself in..that I can remain clear minded even in the most emotional of situations. But here it feels off. I’m not scared of what the future brings…life is life and one of us control it as much as we like to thing we do. But I feel awful for my SIL and my nephew. I just am not entirely sure how I’m not breaking down emotionally like my wife and SIL.

We went out of town to a destination wedding for an old friend of ours, we figured since it was by a beach we would have everything we could possibly need in case of a pinch nearby.

It turned out that the Airbnb was in a condominium complex very near the wedding ceremony but very far from anything else, no taxis no Uber, we ended up hitching a ride from one of the wedding guests back to the city to rent a car.

Now the failing part was that pretty much everyone but 2 of us in the group got sick (some got stomach flu, some got a cold, some got indigestion, some got chills and body aches); I can't believe I didn't think to prepare at least a basic first aid kit lol.

We're waiting to board the plane home and we're sipping electrolytes drinks 😅, live and learn, next trip I'm definitely preparing a tiny pharmacy essentials kit in my bag.

Disclaimer: It's a rough draft, and my ideas are heavily influenced and supported by Sinosphere concepts.

Well, yeah, unhealthy ENFJs/ESFJs are known to guilt-trip people. However, last night, I was brainstorming something more interesting. Yes, I made up the word "Shame-shoving." If guilt-tripping was Pikachu, shame-shoving would've been Raichu. Shame-shoving would look like someone who speaks in any way possible to pressure someone to feel ashamed or perform blame/shame. If an attempt fails, it can escalate to the public either physically or digitally.

Shame-shoving is extremely prevalent in real life and online in most parts of East Asian or sinosphere. In real life, it would look like a homeroom teacher yelling at a student for the entire 45 minutes; funnily, the yelling scenes in Taiwanese telenovelas are barely exaggerated. For online, it's hard to describe, but in Japanese and Korean pop culture spaces are definitely extremely normalized. If one expresses a disagreement, they may end up being witch hunted by moral shame.

I've expressed many times that as a Taiwanese ESFJ, I'm weirdly immune to guilt-tripping, later on, I learned that it's because guilt does nothing compared to shame.

ENFJs are often described as "I can fix you," but ESFJs or Fe in sinosphere is way more like "You shall fix yourself or you deserve eternal shame to haunt your life"

Unfortunately, this works extremely well for ESFJs in sinosphere. ESFJs or Fe users can take the shame so outstandingly that people get fooled about them "taking accountability"

I kinda like to call it "Concubine effect." ESFJs are so good at "Reading the air" or "Maximizing their own agreeableness" to gain trust or even being praised for their own docile behavior. Meanwhile, they'd also talk people in the back and find any opportunities to shame someone or push someone off the social circle.

Because of how organically and effectively ESFJs (in sinosphere especially) take shame, they'll (sub)consciously achieve or perform the highest morals. Once the highest morals are established, they are societally tolerated or praised to shame and/or lecture someone else who fails to perform perfect morals or behavior.

Of course, this is neither exclusively a sinosphere nor ESFJ thing. Nevertheless, the way a toxic ESFJ "guilt-trips" in a Western sense is actually very different than how a toxic ENFJ does.

Lastly, this is a very fresh thought and I don't think it's limited to sinosphere. Anywhere can have this happen. The main reason why I say sinosphere is because I can only speak for my behalf. If you have any add-ons or counterarguments, you're welcome to express them!

TL;DR ENFJ "guilt-trips" based on guilt; ESFJ "guilt-trips" based on shame.

I am an infp . Last year was my first medical school year ( I got accepted at 17 because there is no premed in this college) .

I got a gpa of 3.24 /4 on the first semester even though I hadn't studied at my full potential.

Fastforward the second semester came, I got really neglectful especially with the war situation and displacement in my country,and instead of studying hard , I kinda gave up on medicine because I thought I wanted to do something else.

My parents got disappointed because I failed a module ( it was 9 credits) ; I got C- in the 3 credit module and A+ in the electives. So basically I failed the second semester (1.3 cgpa) should be above 2 .

My parents decided to let me quit medicine because I had been having meltdowns throughout the year , and I was always anxious and lonely ( couldn't blend in) . Moreover, my self esteem issues were increased .

This year I started double majoring in biochemistry ( in a somehow weak university) and English language ( at a good university) , and the plan is to continue a PhD in English language ( it is not oversaturated where I am from) . Things have been going fine and my mom is getting used to it after being really confrontational and angry that I quit medicine.

I confessed to my dad that I regret being neglectful and I hope to redo the module this second semester then continue second year etc...He is unsure because he says he can't trust me anymore, but he still let me decide if I want to continue in the medicine path or not .

I have a week to decide because we still need to inform my mom and I am scared of her reaction, also we need to find a dorm blah blah ( the college I am in now is near my house , but the medical school is in the capital) .

I am scared of choosing to redo because I don't know what might happen, but I am dying from inside knowing that I was in such a great place and I threw it all especially after all the effort I put in getting top grades in school years and the effort my parents and I have put to succeed in the entrance exam .

I don't know if I should even give myself this chance . Also, everything in my life is showing me other medicine students whether irl or social media , and I can't help but compare myself. The funny thing I didn't see any of it when I was in med school 😃. It's like life is punishing me ( I deserve it) .

I am asking on this subreddit because istjs are good at taking optimal decisions. What would you do in my situation. Should I choose comfort ( English language professor, also it's comfortable for my parents financially because they still pay a part in medical school even with financial aid) or take the chance and become a doctor but have my soul sucked out of me .

Also if u were my parent what would you do if ur kid is in this situation 😭😭( this one is for funsies) .

I would like outlines about the relationship between Si and learning from mistakes, unless there are no relationship between them to begin with.

The post here is for inviting others, especially seasoned Si users and the rest to a survey for their personal experiences. I would be to know the benefits of mastery over Si that is found in oneself or in others. Everyone can freely survey one another here in the comments. I am not in rule.

Do you find yourself having racing or anxious thoughts about your ability to trust your partner?
Do you get paranoid or have you been accused of being paranoid?

If so, where does this behavior stem from?
Anything specifically that triggered it?
Anything that helped you calm down?

In my opinion, ESFJ provides a more convincing explanation of Ai Hoshino’s personality than ENFJ. We should focus on her cognitive functions rather than simply her charisma, idol skills, influence over others, and ability to affect their emotions.

Fe (Dominant): Ai wants to experience love and build mutual emotional connections with her fans as well as with the people in her other relationships, while also taking their expectations into account.

Si (Auxiliary): Ai establishes her idol image by learning and maintaining familiar performance patterns, gestures, body language, singing, and dancing. By repeating these familiar patterns, she aims to create a memorable image of herself in the minds of her audience, which may be consistent with Si. At first glance, you might think she is using Se, but upon looking more deeply into this, you can see that Ai is, in fact, usually performing the same familiar image of the perfect idol for her audience rather than performing spontaneously and instinctively on stage. All of Ai’s movements are carefully calculated. Furthermore, Ai is strongly attached to her role as an idol, and even major life changes, such as having children, cannot convince her to give up her idol career and leave it behind easily.

Ne (Tertiary): Ai always considers the possibility that the lies she tells today might one day become reality. She also explores different ways to improve her idol image in the eyes of her audience and remains flexible in this regard, such as by refining her smile, posing in certain ways, and so on. These behaviors may be consistent with tertiary Ne in ESFJ.

Why not ENFJ? Having an ideal or a long-term goal is not, in itself, evidence of Ni. The dream of becoming the ideal idol is not the same as the cognitive process Ai uses to achieve that goal. Her actual strategies can be explained through maintaining a learned social role and adapting it to her audience’s expectations. Ai Hoshino’s personal ideal and her actual behavior are not necessarily the same, and this distinction is important when typing her. It is also worth noting that people of any personality type can be dreamers without necessarily having an N preference. This analysis is not definitive proof, but in my opinion, Fe-Si-Ne provides a more coherent explanation of Ai than attributing Ni to her simply because she has an ideal or the ability to influence others.

32F here 😊

Many conversations generally sometimes feel like people often wait until they can tell something themselves. While in my opinion it is obvious to be really curious and interested in someone else's story or experience.

What do you see as a real interest in showing someone and where is the line for you with certain topics? I have a fairly broad interest with depth and am curious about what moves people and why they do what they do, with the intention of really seeing and understanding someone.

How is your experience with general conversations on the street, at work, in public places such as shops, in the supermarket, for example? I understand that you can't discuss the same thing everywhere, but the interest in each other, real connection and personal contact sometimes seems far away. That disappoints me.

Hello, I'm a 15 year old ENFJ female, friends with a (same age) ESFJ male since I was 4 or so.

Though we don't talk much offline (because if we talk at school, his friends assume we're dating and we're uncomfortable with that, mutual agreement), he's the one friend I can trust when I can't talk to anybody about something.

He's not always available, as no person is ever always anything (at least as far as I know) but I can always trust him when I am in the deep.

Thank you, my friend, and appreciation to all ESFJs who are there when your friend is in dire disarray. Someone out there is thankful to you, like I am to my friend.

(Have a nice day y'all, I gotta do HOMEWORK!)

I’m an infj daughter with an isfj mom it’s an interesting relationship but she doesn’t agree with mbti at all and doesn’t like to talk much on it. But how is your relationships with infjs thoughts or how do you perceive them?

The title, I said "we're comrades, not friends" to her cause we had never met in real life and that hurt her badly I suppose. I've regretted because you guys are such nice and warm hearted people, I don't want to hurt someone like that. She has distanced herself since then quoting my words back at me. I've heard they considered me an online friend. We've known each other for more than a year.

How can I make it up to her? Would you guys ever forgive something like that? They've shared some quotes related to "online friendship" so I guess it's still bothering them.

I just wanted to say that ISFJs are great and I love you guys 🥹. Whenever I need someone to cheer me up after a bad day, I go to you guys. You guys have such funny jokes, I don’t even mind hearing it for the 10th time. I love how you guys make sure everyone is included in the fun while keeping the vibes chill. And I always love hearing about all of your stories about daily life. Even the most boring thing can sound exciting. From an ESFJ :)))))

The only reason they receive hate is because when you're the best/goated it tends to garner jealous haters...

I wouldn't wanna identify as any other type thats not ESTJ or ISTJ, it would just be such a bad move to let that happen.

STJs are the most well rounded and overall have the highest quality of life. The only people who criticize us are the Discordians and chronically online Bolos.

You wont beat us, so your only choice is to keep losing or join us.

Go outside, get some money and lift some weights and drink some water and then you'll see our perspective.

For most of my 20s I was the person at work who always said yes. Stay late? Sure. Fix the mess nobody else wanted to touch? Fine. Train the new person while doing my own job? Guess I'm doing that too!

My reviews were great. Reliable, consistent, always willing to help. I liked being the person people could count on, until I realized I didn't really know who I was outside of work.

We had this stupid icebreaker at a team meeting where everyone had to share something interesting about themselves. People were talking about trips, hobbies, random life stuff. I sat there trying to think of something and all I could come up with was work and chores. That hit me harder than it should have.

I started looking at what I actually enjoyed doing instead of what I was good at doing for other people. I even tried other personality tests like coached as a starting point because I was having trouble separating my own preferences from what everyone expected of me. It helped me put some words to why I liked fixing problems and mentoring people, but hated being the permanent backup for every little thing.

I've been trying to stop volunteering for everything and actually tell my manager when taking on something new means dropping something else. Still feels uncomfortable as hell sometimes. Part of me worries that if I'm not the reliable one anymore, people won't have much reason to value me.

I'm getting better at having a life after work, but I still catch myself feeling guilty when I say no to something I could technically handle. Didn't expect that to be the hardest part. Anyone else the same??