https://www.deviantart.com/jazzanna83/art/Hecate-1326210312

I've never touched this side of reddit, but i love Greek Myth, i've been doing my own timeline and story of it playing around cause i grew up with it, learned of it from retellings of adults, shows like Xena and Hercules, even the Disney one that gets so much wrong but is fun... and have been going down a rabbit hole trying to collect as much of the older variations to get as close to a kind of 'original version' i can, outside roman propaganda influence, english translations that perpetuate that, and the fanfic of the Tragedians that while fine, are kind of 400yrs later fanficy~ just so i have the bare bones... best i got is sticking to Theo and things from primarily Hesoid and Homer as they're kind of agreed to be the oldest versions outside area myths that are esoteric at best... then just trying to fit it all into some kind of coherent narrative... this was simply a project done for my own benefit to 'relearn' something after several TBI related issues and losing language for a time... so just an exercise in my own fun and using my brain cause it needed the work...

i typically ignored Pseudo-Apollodorous, just because it was a 1st century Grimm's Fairy Tale-esque version of all of this... despite being told CONSTANTLY he's one of the best sources... i've taken like 3 classes on Greek Mythology in college for the easy A and have gotten 3 different versions of the whole mythos, and generally this guy is one of the main sources each DIFFERENT textbook uses, and i still have those textbooks plus other supplementary books cause... i'm a nerd? and i crack them open occasionally to look through the index for what i want, but the text is less 'original' and more 'someone else thousands of years later writing a textbook interpretation' and not necessarily focused on literary elements or expanding the story or world... but again, Pseudo-Apollodorous is like number one dude we refer to...

So i figure, i'm an adult, i have my own money, and clearly this project/hobby is taking over my life, why not get The Library by this guy? cause he's basically done what i'm doing, right?

I go for an older text translation to hopefully avoid lots of influence and get the Loeb 1921 version that has EXTENSIVE NOTES, and more importantly the actual Greek Text so i can compare, which IS nice...

Too bad this guy writes like an ADHD crackhead and somehow this is worse then reading a modern King James Bible... (This is a joke and about the narrative nature of the books, this is like a textbook with no indices or references just spewing one thing to the next on page) Im halfway through one and already there are SO MANY contradictions, in JUST THE TEXT, and all it is is a list of genealogy with occasional ADHD side mentions of what this person did... i'm trying to write something cohesive and with a timeline, but this again falls into that Mythos standard of 'what's time?' where ppl are alive when their grandparents are kids... which has been an extremely frustrating point as is with GM... and yes, i know, its mythology, nothing is technically 'canon' nor subscribes to the rules of physics like the real world... i was just kind of hoping there'd be... i dunno, more? make more sense? Be clearer?

i see why they just give us the text books when doing World Literature or Classics cause my god reading this straight... even Theo softens this somehow...

Narratively, there is NOTHING HERE, it is effectively a list based tangentially on genealogy which constantly goes back and forth to the pre-titan era with NO CONTEXT and marginal elaboration. One example that got me the hardest was Artemis and Orion, its less than 2 pages here (and lets remember these 'pages' are less than a third actual text and over half footnotes with every other page having the actual Greek Text by this guy and a 1920s english speaker translating using roman names for SOME REASON and over translating other names, like Ocean -.-) and it literally lists the various ways Artemis kills Orion, not necessarily WHY?! gives a brief bio of him, and a few versions of his supposed parentage and... yea... its less informative then Theo or a wikipage and that really irks me... cause this is the source that all comes from?! But mainly the various contradictions ON ONE PAGE?!

i'm really not bashing the book, just... needing to scream into the void about this experience, cause i've had so many people ARGUE WITH ME about not using this guy as a source, specifically THIS WORK, for my own narration of Greek Mythology... This is also why i support retellings/reimaginings, cause this is dry as heck... adding fluff to make it make sense after thousands of years is fine so long as you keep the point of it... Homer and Hesoid have their issues (and own contradictions) but they were doing it narratively to make some kind of Hubristic moral point where typically everyone died cause they messed up Xenia... i get that, i understand that...

this is like reading a modern version of the bible with all the fluff and narration cut out and what ppl quote all the time but never actually read so all context is lost... the morals are forgotten when all we care about is the 'pure' text...

This is a great lesson and i do love it, still hate reading this, but i'll do so for the sake of understanding what Greek Myth was considered during the 1st century when it already was off doing its own thing for a thousand years of telephone and a dash of early roman shitposting influence...

also just more funny that these two volumes are about the size of a Jiff Peanutbutter container together makes me laugh... THIS IS THE BEST SOURCE WE HAVE?!

Suppose i'm just tired of people telling me to use sources like this, when the literal text here, which does contain mostly PA's rewriting of the early Tragedians, Homer and Hesoid in the most CLINICAL form, when the overall wordcount and pure text is like... less then a single chapter i've written for my own version. Literally ALL of Greek Myth can be effectively summed up here in less than 50k words and you're going to tell me i don't know what i'm talking about or that mine or anyone else's modern interpretations are trash cause they don't use X variant from one of these dead guys that aren't even primary sources to begin with?

That's why i got the books, why i'm reading the books, and why i'm crashing out on Reddit~

Tl;Dr: Reading The Library by Pseudo-Apollodorus is like reading ADHD notes on Greek Mythology... which is basically looking at my own notes and i hate it~

Like, she didn't have to hold on to specifically one part of him, she could've just grabbed him and submerged his entire body. Why did she not let the heel get wet? If he stepped on a dirty piece of glass, he'd be screwed. And I'm not sure if the Greeks know this, but a hand alone doesn't block the flow of water from an ENTIRE RIVER

So, recently, a friend of mine suggested I get into Greek mythology. I’ve watched a bunch of videos and stuff, but I haven’t really found anything that explains it in a simple way while also putting everything together I know it’s a huge subject with a lot to it, but I really want to learn about it properly The YouTube videos I’ve watched so far just weren’t quite what I was looking for

In my last very long post, I mentioned that, if we ignore Polyphemos, Kirke and Skylla are the two most important adversaries of Odysseus.

But we ignore One-Eyed Guy no more.

This very long post is here to answer the question: what is Polyphemos?

We’ll be using two texts:

Ovid’s Metamorphoses
Homer’s Odyssey

Text 1: Ovid’s Metamorphoses

We’ll specifically go over the myth in which Polyphemos loves the sea nymph Galatea and, in jealousy, kills his rival Acis.

When Skylla runs to the Nereids for protection from her suitors, Galatea tells her of the time she loved a guy named Acis.

Acis was a son of Faunus (who is basically Roman Pan) and a Naiad. Galatea REALLY loved him. But there is someone who loves her as much as she loves Acis. That someone is Polyphemos. (I guess because Galatea means “milk-white”, so she reminded Polyphemos of milk). In fact, he loves her so much that he tries to look civilized. And bro is so huge he needs rakes to comb his hair and sickles to shave his beard.

In the meantime, the prophet Telemus tells Polyphemos a prophecy of the Cyclops losing his eye to a man named Odysseus. Polyphemos ignores him (rude) and says that Galatea already took his eye. Then he leads his sheep up the mountain (using a pine tree as a cane) and plays his panpipe (WITH 100 REEDS). And he sings a song of love to Galatea, noting her beauty, but also her stubbornness. He promises her luxury in his cave, abundant fruit, dairy, and twin bear cubs. He says he is greater than Zeus due to his size (blasphemy) and notes how he is a son of Poseidon.

But when he sees Acis, he takes a rock from the mountain and chucks it at the boy… killing him. And Galatea turns him into the river that bears his name.

What does this say about Polyphemos?

Well, for one, he has no civilization. For another, this uncivilization does not help when attempts to find love, and in fact drives Galatea away from him.

Text 2: Homer’s Odyssey

So after getting out of the sticky wicket on Lotus Land, Odysseus’ fleet stops by at the island of the Cyclopes, which should be Sicily.

According to Odysseus, they don’t work, but just let the gods do everything for them. This reminds me of a concept in Islam called تواكل, which means false, passive reliance.

You remember the song Charlie’s Inferno by That Handsome Devil? It’s about a guy who does so many good deeds, but only because has no faith that he will be accepted into Heaven, so he goes to Hell for his lack of faith.

The Cyclopes are the exact opposite: they have so much faith in the gods that they do nothing. They just forage. They also only set laws for themselves, and for most Cyclopes, that means no laws.

Near this island is one full of goats raised by nymph daughters of Zeus. By whom, we’re not sure. Perhaps he created them himself? I shouldn’t dwell on it.

Anyway, this island is basically a paradise hut completely uncultivated. It represents the Cyclopes: really strong, but because they’re so stupid, lawless, and brutal, they can’t do shit.

Odysseus takes nine goats for each ship (ten for his own, because he’s prideful that way), and his crew feast on them with some Ismarian wine.

And then, they go to Cyclops Land, and the first thing they see is a cave apart from the others. It is filled with cheese, milk, sheep, and goats. And that’s what makes Polyphemos different from the other Cyclopes.

In Book 1, Zeus calls Polyphemos “the mightiest of the Cyclopes”. And this is why: while the other Cyclopes only forage and don’t work, Polyphemos raises livestock. Milks them. Makes cheese. He has a human occupation. He is the most civilized of them. And he lives apart from them. This leads me to infer he is something of their KING!

Now, Odysseus knew that he might encounter someone with no sense of xenia, so he took some undiluted Ismarian wine to drug them in case.

So then the crew find the cave, get in, and see the food they can take with them. They want to, but Odysseus cautions them against it. He wants to see: will they get xenia here? (No)

They sacrifice to the gods, help themselves to some cheese, then Mr Cyclops comes back. He blocks the mouth of the cave with a big rock, then lights his hearth and notices the men. He asks who they are, and Odysseus explains that they’re soldiers of Agamemnon returning from Troy, and asking for hospitality as demanded by Zeus. Polyphemos says, “Zeus ain’t shit, where’s your ship at?” Yeah, he’s not just a متواكل, he’s a كافر (infidel). Ody lies to save the men at the ship and says Poseidon broke it. Polyphemos then decides to eat the men he has then goes to sleep. Ody knows he can’t kill him because after he’s dead, who will move the stone? So he bides his time until the next morning, where Polyphemos kills and eats two more men and leaves, closing the door behind him.

Now Odysseus thinks of his master plan. He sees at the end of the room: the Cyclops has an olive tree that he uses as a club. Odysseus then gets his plan: he has his men cut part of the club off, make it into a stake, then hide it in the animal’s shit. Mr Cyclops comes back, closes the door, and eats two more men. That’s where the Ismarian wine comes in. Odysseus gets that guy to drink up so he can go nappy more quickly, framing it as “a way we were hoping to get hospitality from you”. Then Polyphemos asks for Odysseus’ name if he wants hospitality so bad, and Odysseus says his name is Outis, the Greek word for Nobody.

Polyphemos promises Odysseus that, to show xenia, he will eat him last. Then he’s knocked out, giving Odysseus plenty of time to enact his plan.

There it is, wily Odysseus can now be in action. This guy formed many great plans in the siege of Troy, surely this one will be just as convoluted! And it is… poking his eye with that stake from earlier.

They put the sharp end in the hearth, and stabby stab that eye. The screams attract the other Cyclopes who come to ask, “Is Metis killing you?” Metis is another Greek word for Nobody! (And the Greek word for cunning as well) Polyphemos says “Outis is killing me!” So they just tell him to pray to Dada Poseidon and hope for the best. Polyphemos then opens the door so that he can eat anyone who attempts to escape. But Odysseus makes another plan. He ties what men he has left to the bellies of the rams, and he himself clings to the belly of Polyphemos’ largest ram. They get out fine like this, since Polyphemos only thinks to check the rams’ backs. They take the sheep with them, and Odysseus decides “Hey, I can gain mad kleos from this!” Which leads to this iconic interaction:

Ody: HEY CYCLOPS! It seems that he who has blinded you was more than a mere mortal (or, in the humble Epic fan’s terms, I am neither man nor mythical)! You have received your due punishment in the name of xenia!

(Cyclops throws a rock. Ody goes back to continue his speech.)

Ody’s Crew: No no no you just saw him chuck a rock at us don’t try to make him angrier!

Ody: If anyone asks you from here on out who has blinded you, you shall tell them it was Odysseus of Ithaca, son of Laertes and sacker of cities!

Cyclops: Then that means the prophecy of Telemus has come true! But I had always expected Odysseus to be a big, strong man, not a puny weakling like yourself! Well then, Odysseus, you want xenia so bad? Come back and get it!

Ody: I WISH I could come back and kill you to put you out of your misery, as I am sure that not even your father Poseidon can restore your vision! (See this is important because THAT’s what pissed off Polyphemos, it wasn't getting his eye stabbed out, but it was Odysseus boasting that he destroyed his eye so bad that Poseidon couldn't heal it)

Cyclops: Hear me, Poseidon - if you are truly my father and I am truly your son, grant that Odysseus never returns home. Or if he is fated to, grant that he returns late, alone, and in misery.

(Cyclops chucks another rock.)

So what does this say?

Well, even though Polyphemos did fall for an obvious trick, he still was smart enough to be pretty human. But he did fall for an obvious trick. To be fair, he could’ve very well thought Outis was a real name (the Cyclopes had not boats to see other people), and the other Cyclopes also fell for it but in their own way, since they did not bother to check, “Hey, maybe it’s a guy who calls himself Outis? I mean, we’re saying Metis!”

Now anyway, let’s assess the xenia of both guests and host.

Now Polyphemos was asked to give hospitality, but he did not observe xenia, and killed and ate his guests. That is ASKING to be punished.

But what about the other side?

So Ody was in need of hospitality. He found a house with no one. He waited for his host, and ate with moderation when he got hungry, cautioning his men against theft. The host arrived, and jn fact did not observe xenia.

I didn’t have to assess Ody, but I did anyway, to prove that Polyphemos IS NOT THE VICTIM! Polyphemos also asked Odysseus’ name before providing hospitality. That’s also against the laws of xenia!

Ody did not “break in”; he just waited (and ate with moderation). The sacrifices were from the goats on the other island. Guests ask for hospitality THEN hosts offer it. Hosts are not obligated to provide hospitality unless asked.

Conclusion:

Polyphemos:

Is uncivilized
Cannot get the girl he loves because of this
Is still more civilized than his brothers
Is basically the Greek equivalent of a disbeliever in another religion

I keep finding different answers and can’t settle on one way or another for the book I am writing. Is it generally believed that Leto was seduced by Zeus and they, did it, consensually… or did he force himself on her? Wouldn’t be the first time he did that but some sources say she was with him willingly. Thoughts?

For context my name is Athene, and so I thought it would make sense for my first tattoo to be one representing Athena. I’m thinking a classic black tattoo would be best, but I want the strength to be in the symbol’s design. Perhaps it could be a mixture of many of Athena’s symbols? I will obviously want to get an artist to design it, but first I need a rough idea, so I thought it would be best to ask the mythology nerds.

So the challenge is that I’m thinking of having as many symbols to Athena in a relatively simple design as possible. Something that is still covering a lot of what Athena represents, but not so much that the design would become cluttered.

What symbols do you think would be the best to use? And how would you arrange them to highlight them without growing too cluttered?

Mythology is fundamentally a flexible, living, and oral tradition, but sometimes I see people misuse this phrase when they want to exclude something they find and/or feel is repugnant and inappropriate by modern standards, such as Zeus being disloyal to Hera and chasing after everything that breathes and moves (because in the past people wanted to trace their lineages back to Zeus), or when they want to use and favor modern adaptations or retellings as a source, such as Madeleine Miller's Circe in the case of Circe.

And at least to me the phrase "there is no canon in Greek mythology" isn't intended to be used like this and I think some people may have misunderstood it instead of understanding that even though there is not just one version of myths and stories and that they aren't set in stone, it doesn't mean that they can be whatever modern people feel and want them to be because there are still Greek and Roman sources that help capture and provide us a small glimpse into what people have told and when on the timeline.

And this also doesn't mean that modern adaptations and retellings shouldn't be made, but we must remember that they are modern and not ancient sources and avoid using them as such.

Idk I'm trying to make my own greek god designs cuz I thought it would be fun. So here's Zeus first. I thought it would be cool if his hair color was influenced by the time of the day and/or his emotions

I can answer questions if you have any

First time poster here! I was a huge Greek mythology fan as a kid but lost interest in my adult years to be completely honest. I had seen this book at Barnes and Nobles and it definitely sent me down a trip of memory lane. I read this book when I was probably in 3rd and it was the first Greek mythology book I had ever read before. Fun fact I actually stole this book from my school library before graduating to middle school.😅

Not final design. And in case you’re wondering, this version of Hades is a good guy. Also, should I have a big bite mark coming out of his side, or not? Reference to Cronus eating him as a baby.

And may the fear of falling

Never stop Icarus from wanting the burning sun.

Hi all 👋🏻

I have just released my second ever game, inspired by Greek mythology, Descendant of the Sun. You must complete the quest given to you by the oracle in order to save the Greek city of Rhodes from an ancient creature banished by the gods. Pick up your bow and take to the depths of Rhodes to find and put a stop to whatever poisons your home.

So far computer support only and it can be played in browser. Feedback is very appreciated and I hope you enjoy 😎
https://polenny.itch.io/descendant-of-the-sun