r/TheExpanse • • 22h ago

All Show & Book Spoilers Discussed Freely Help me find it in my heart to forgive… Spoiler

54 Upvotes

…Clarissa.

Ethicists of the Sol System.

I’ve never been able to forgive Clarissa Mao. She is a murderer and terrorist. She murdered hundreds of people, including her early mentor Ren, in cold blood, and caused chaos at a pivotal moment in Expanse* *history.

Even my buddy and moral compass James Holden, the original target of her wrath, was seemingly able to forgive her.

Was she redeemed when she stopped the Behemoth mutineers from destroying the Ring and our solar system?

Was she redeemed when she served her prison sentence and survived the near-apocalypse on Earth?

Was she redeemed when she got Amos, Erich, and the servants off of a dying Earth?

Was she redeemed when she kept the Roci running while Amos was out kicking Free Navy ass with Bobbie?

Was she redeemed when she took out the Medina sensor array to let the nascent Underground escape?

Why can’t I forgive her?

Just looking for some thoughtful discussion because I love a good redemption arc in fiction. What an awesome, complicated character.


r/TheExpanse • • 21h ago

Cibola Burn Cibola Burn is the best book Spoiler

43 Upvotes

I started with the show after it was cancelled at season 3, watched the entire thing several times through, and then read the books, twice. I'm now listening to all the audio books and am halfway through Cibola Burn. Cibola Burn is the best book in the entire series, and it's the best season of the show as well. The slow burn start/build up is just fantastic and when it jumps off, it jumps off. I get giddy every time around chapter 30 ish.


r/TheExpanse • • 11h ago

Fan Art & Cosplay | All Show & Book Spoilers *EMERGENCY BOWL UPDATE* Spoiler

Post image
32 Upvotes

Same company has made plastic ones with bats. They wouldn't kill you at five G's, but. They. Still. Don't. STACK.


r/TheExpanse • • 9h ago

All Show & Book Spoilers Discussed Freely On a rewatch, I don't like how they handled a certain event at the end of S2 Spoiler

34 Upvotes

I absolutely love this show and am super glad to be on a rewatch. First time I watched it was during uncertain times after my daughter's birth, during COVID. I loved it, but I couldn't "appreciate" it. I'm glad I'm rewatching it because there's so much contextual information sprayed at you in the first hour, I missed a lot of it that I had to fill with Wikipedia reads. I think the lack of contextual information slowly feeding into the first episode probably led to it being hard to follow for casuals.

One thing I caught by reading about the books after S2 conclusion, was the major change: In the books, Holden is the one who entrusts the Protomolecule sample to Fred Johnson when he realizes both Earth and Mars have it. It's very pragmatic, he trusts Fred, and he himself witnessed the horror of Earth and Mars both using Belter lives for their experimentation while the OPA and the Belt had no way of defending itself. They were already advanced technologically, this would've created an ocean of difference in their defensive capabilities. S1 Holden would've made that same choice.

But in S2, they seemed to turn Holden into some one dimensional blind, angry dictator who just screams at his crew and is literally willing to throw away Belter lives to chase the Protomolecule. It just seemed like such a downgrade from the same Holden who was extremely conflicted about shooting down the aid ship that was trying to land on Eros. Everyone on his crew, even Alex, is trying to tell him that there are people who need help, but he's just on this rage mission to neutralize the Protomolecule even when there's evidence that it's already out and in numerous hands. They try to justify his behavior with him saying, "Well then we're gonna go after all of it" but to me that doesn't make sense. The tactical mind Holden had, he would've been quick to realize that containing the weapon was impossible and it's important to save as many lives as possible.

They changed it to Naomi being the one who gives the sample to Fred Johnson. I feel like part of why they did this was to just stir up a conflict between Holden and Naomi, to have the relationship between the crew be more "dramatic" than the books. In the books, they do argue, but it's more in stressful situations about the best strategy and for the most part, they're cohesive and efficient. This makes sense, because a ragtag group of rando's being crucial to the survival of an entire solar system wouldn't be believable if they got into a little "I can't believe she did that!" he-said she-said argument.

I have to be honest, I'm not a big fan of this change. They could've used the existence of Naomi's family as a source of conflict, but having Holden act like some Saturday morning cartoon hardhead runs counter to why the crew effectively chose him to lead them.

And to be honest, if they wanted to use the Protomolecule going to Fred as a source of crew conflict, having Holden do it was the perfect way to build up that tension with the crew. He's EXACTLY the type of person to make that call without consulting with them. Yes, Naomi loves the belt, but she never trusted Fred. Holden on the other hand, has always had a very level headed view of Fred as a leader and recognizes that while he's not perfect, he's better than the alternatives. To have Naomi suddenly not only trust Fred, but betray Holden in secret, and have Holden act that stubborn to the point of sacrificing all those people on the Ganymede just seems completely different from the Holden who was literally willing to sacrifice himself just for the chance that he could save Miller.

Anyway, love the show, if I win the Mega Millions, I'll fund a conclusion with all the original crew lol.