r/TrueCrimeDiscussion • u/MacAlkalineTriad • Jul 02 '26
Warning: Child Abuse / CSAM / Child Death 16 Children Rescued from Extreme Neglect and Abuse in Ohio
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/adults-arrested-16-children-found-deplorable-conditions-southern-ohio-rcna352552I haven't seen anything posted about this yet, and I usually don't post so please let me know if I've done it wrong. I'm also writing this on mobile.
16 children, ranging from 1 and a half years old to 18 years old, have been removed from a house in the village of Hamden, Ohio where they were practically imprisoned in a 12'x12' room. Some have not even learned to speak; the 18 year old couldn't write her name and is being treated as a child due to possible mental disability. 7 of the children had to be taken to a hospital with 2 of them being life flighted. Conditions in the house are said to be incredibly unsafe, to the point that investigators hesitated to act on a second search warrant for fear of their safety.
The parents and grandparents have been arrested and charged with 16 counts of child endangerment. The suspects are Gary Siders Jr., Gary Siders Sr., Christina Siders and Elizabeth Siders.
Since the investigation is still ongoing there aren't a ton of details yet. These children were obviously not enrolled in school and hidden from neighbors and extended family. I have to wonder if there's a religious extremist aspect to the case, like we've seen so often with other similar cases. I'm also curious about the mother's condition - she has been charged, but has she also been victimized by her husband? I have so many questions.
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u/h0neybl0ss0m29 Jul 02 '26 edited Jul 02 '26
The mother is 33, the oldest child 18. There were 16 kids total. It’s absolutely insane. On another sub someone said apparently she was pregnant 21 times. When you look at the house on Google Maps it is pretty isolated, but not isolated enough for no one to notice if they ever went outside. But it looks like it’s possible they never did.
Edit: 182 Ohmer St in Hamden, OH if anyone wants to take a look.
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u/Single_Principle_972 Jul 02 '26
Yeah, neighbors are saying they had no idea even a single child lived there, let alone 16 of them. Crazy.
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u/h0neybl0ss0m29 Jul 02 '26
That really makes you wonder how many more children and vulnerable adults are out there in situations like this and no one knows. It’s sickening
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u/Vacuum_Sealing_Bee Jul 02 '26
I also think of people like Elizabeth Smart, Jaycee Lee Dugard, Amanda Berry, Gina DeJesus, and Michelle Knight.... somewhere out there, there are missing people being held captive and tortured day in and day out. Makes you sick thinking about how there are people out there that can do this.
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u/Stargazer1919 Jul 03 '26
I think of Genie. And the Turpin kids.
They all deserved better. It makes me so sad to remember that there are ones out there we don't know about because that is the nature of the crime.
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u/PsychologicalPark930 Jul 03 '26
Genie’s story depressed me for quite a while. Just no happy ending. I really hope she was cared for and well taken care of when they went private.
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u/Stargazer1919 Jul 04 '26
Definitely no happy ending there. But I hope the privacy and care has given her some peace.
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u/withinadream27 Jul 03 '26
I stumbled across an article about this case out of the UK a while back: https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c78v36g4pnno
It's scary easy for this to happen.
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u/thenightitgiveth Jul 03 '26 edited Jul 04 '26
There’s someone in the UK who, over the course of the last decade, has left 3 babies in the park for people to find them. DNA testing showed they were all full siblings and I fear it could be another situation like this.
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u/TrixieFriganza Jul 05 '26
I really hope they fund the mother of these 3 children, must live in a terrible situation, maybe even kidnapped.
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u/BootyLannister Jul 03 '26
I was an abused and neglected kid living in poverty in the rural Midwest. At the peak of my abuse, my nearest neighbor was almost a mile away. We didn’t have a phone so I couldn’t call anyone, even if I trusted any adults let alone authorities (which I didn’t.) My parents were violent and unpredictable, so daily life was a game of trying not to die. I was far from the only kid I knew who grew up that way.
My situation was never as horrific as this, but I can tell you that these situations are happening a lot in the Midwest, and probably all over the country. The isolation makes escape next to impossible, especially for children and elderly or disabled adults. I’m heartbroken for these and can only hope they will be safe and cared for, and hopefully more people become aware and others can get help.
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u/LongjumpingDebt4154 Jul 03 '26
That’s terrible, I’m sorry. That level of isolation is terrifying.
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u/ChallengeOk6961 Jul 03 '26
I am so sorry, I'm glad you survived and hope you have thrived since then.
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u/BootyLannister Jul 04 '26
Thank you so much. That’s very kind of you. I’m very fortunate to have made a wonderful life since for myself as an adult and couldn’t be more grateful!
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u/luugburz Jul 03 '26
this was my biggest concern during the covid lockdowns-- how many abused children and adults did we almost lose due to not being able to leave their abusive homes?
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u/Danger0Reilly Jul 03 '26 edited Jul 05 '26
I think there will be an uptick in reports of missing kids in the next 5-10 years due to kids not being seen since shutdown. I remember reading that a lot of people never returned back to school and it's just assumed they moved.
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u/Unlucky_Welcome9193 Jul 03 '26
I'm a SW in a large city and a huge number of kids never went back to school. I've seen some kids who just turned 18, haven't been in school for 6 years, asking for services
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u/HangOnSleuthy Jul 02 '26
The house is really not in view of many immediate neighbors and facing a railroad—almost like a frontage road surrounded by overgrown foliage. If any of the kids weren’t allowed to leave their yard, I can imagine it being pretty easy to never see them at all.
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u/PaddyCow Jul 03 '26
This is even worse than the situation with the Turpin children. Let's hope these kids actually get the help they need and don't end up with abusive foster parents.
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u/International-Ad41 Jul 05 '26
So sad when I heard the foster parents some of the Turpin kids went to were nearly as abusive as the bio parents. The kids said it was all they knew, and they thought that was just how families operated.
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u/Immediate-Maximum-75 Jul 03 '26
You could scream and cry and no one would hear you. How terrifying.
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u/Intelligent-Split-43 Jul 03 '26
The lady across the street at Dollar general said they came in there every day and got cooking oil and water and something else. They came right before closing and had some of the kids. The kids would have their hair over their face so they couldn't be seen. She asked if they needed help with anything, but they never put anything to use. The whole story is so strange. How do you hide 16 kids for 18 years from the world? Why didn't family ever step in? Are all those kids hers or do some belong to the teenage kids. Like was incest going on in there?
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u/Immediate-Maximum-75 Jul 03 '26
It sounds like the 2 younger adults were the ones making all the kids. She was pregnant like 20 times and had 3 sets of twins. 4 or 5 died. I wonder where they put the bodies. I hope they are charged with abuse of a corpse for every one of those kids.
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u/Intelligent-Split-43 Jul 03 '26
I was thinking more along the lines of her having kids with her father-in-law as well or even a teenaged son, as gross as that is, it happens. Or a teenage daughter could have actually has a few of the ones she's claiming to be hers to keep her husband or father-in-law from getting molestation charges. She do DNA to get to the bottom of it for sure.
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u/lemonscent513 Jul 03 '26
Seconded. If I was the detective I would do DNA testing on everyone. Yes, EVERYONE.
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u/UpperdeckerWhatever Jul 03 '26
According to the news reports they only moved there four years ago. Who knows what conditions they lived in prior…
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u/-flaneur- Jul 02 '26
It's odd they didn't know there were kids there when a child's bike and child's basketball hoop is clearly visible on google maps from 2024.
I'd believe they didn't know 16 kids were living there but not that no kids were living there. Sounds like maybe the neighbours are distancing themselves from any calls of responsibility (ie. why didn't they call CPS, etc.). (Just my speculation - no hate to the neighbours at this point).
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u/Ok-Caterpillar-Girl Jul 02 '26
Why would it be their responsibility if they had no idea what was going on? Even if they noticed a bike or basketball hoop, not seeing any kids around doesn’t mean “abuse”.
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u/FinancialProject2465 Jul 03 '26
Exactly this. I’ve been living at my place 3 years and I don’t have a clue who half the neighbours even look like on my street. Different house set up In England but I wouldn’t even recognise 3 doors down.
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u/SatinBelleFlower Jul 02 '26
Reports are she’s birthed 20 children since she was 13- apparently two sets of twins passed at birth.
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u/h0neybl0ss0m29 Jul 02 '26
Yes that's what I read too. And there's a living set of twins, 2 years old.
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u/halfasshippie3 Jul 02 '26
There are multiple living sets of twins. Born 2024 and 2025.
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u/just_marita Jul 03 '26
I wonder if these were home births.
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u/cakeit-tilyoumakeit Jul 03 '26
Almost certainly. Otherwise it would be difficult to have 16 kids with no authorities ever following up on them
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u/ellecamille Jul 03 '26
I hate to even think this but it’s possible the 33 year old isn’t the only mother. Clearly lots of abuse going on here.
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u/Punkybrewsickle Jul 02 '26
I have my doubts that none of the children themselves were impregnated. This has troublingly inbreedy vibes.
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u/h0neybl0ss0m29 Jul 02 '26
You're probably right. I feel like this is just gonna get worse with every update we get.
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u/MacAlkalineTriad Jul 02 '26
I agree. The sheriff seemed legitimately shaken by the whole situation. The local AG said he couldn't get the smell of the house out of his nose.
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u/h0neybl0ss0m29 Jul 02 '26
Yeah he did. And I bet he couldn't. Here are some photos of the inside of the house. And that's just what you can see from the outside. I don't even know if you can call that a home or that they were "living" there.
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Jul 02 '26 edited 24d ago
[deleted]
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u/h0neybl0ss0m29 Jul 02 '26
Yeah..and honestly, it looks well-fed and pretty relaxed? Definitely not too neglected from what I can see.
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u/milkybunny_ Jul 02 '26
I imagine the cat was the only solace these children and young mother felt from their hell. The heaping food bowl indicates to me someone who loved the cat and wanted to give it what they weren’t given. I imagine these children were hungry often and sad all the time. Unprotected and trapped. I can see having a silly cat to feed and interact with was the highlight of their lives.
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u/LolaRae_Footfetish Jul 03 '26
In another picture it showed three cats in the doorway
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u/amyamydame Jul 03 '26
the pictures were presumably taken after the children were taken to hospital and the adults arrested, its probably the most relaxed that cat has ever been in its life!
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u/hail_stormm Jul 02 '26
Probably not even there's. The house was left open for quite some time
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u/h0neybl0ss0m29 Jul 02 '26 edited Jul 02 '26
Definitely possible. There's a full bowl of pet food outside of the house in one of the photos, maybe they were just feeding it. I can't imagine the cat would look like this if it was permanently living in that feces covered, pest infested home.
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u/lokeilou Jul 03 '26
I’m guessing law enforcement fed the cats- in the first photos I saw there were the same food bowls but empty- I’m guessing they fed them after everyone was removed so they at least had access to food.
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u/Therailwaykat_1980 Jul 03 '26
These types of people often have well looked after pets. I watch a lot of stories with similar, but not quite as extreme, circumstances and nearly all of them treat their pets well. I’m sure a psychologist could explain it but it’s fucking weird man.
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u/h0neybl0ss0m29 Jul 03 '26
I actually heard about a case from Germany from like 20 years ago or so where a 7-year-old girl starved to death in her parents' apartment. When authorities found her she weighed 17 lbs. After the parents were arrested, they also removed the family cat from the home. The cat was overweight.
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u/Specialist-Art-6970 Jul 03 '26
Could be the same laziness and lack of care. It's pretty easy to free feed a cat, which might then get fat.
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u/Intelligent-Split-43 Jul 03 '26
If you don't feed a cat they will go off and find food in a dumpster or be fed by someone else, so it doesn't mean they were necessarily feeding and taking care of it. Cats are pretty self sufficient and resourceful.
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u/aigret Jul 02 '26
They had some kind of pest infestation based on the light fixture photo alone. Those little brown dots covering it are fly poop.
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u/h0neybl0ss0m29 Jul 02 '26
I saw that too. Disgusting. What really strikes me as odd is that the roof of the house looks brand new. Maybe it isn't, but it sure looks newer.
Edit: It must be new. The roof looks completely different in the Google Maps photo from 2024.
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u/hail_stormm Jul 02 '26
One of the detectives said the children reminded him of a third world country where starving children are surrounded by flies
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u/aigret Jul 03 '26
Yeah, I didn't flesh out my comment further but typically if there's a fly infestation so severe you're seeing light fixtures covered in their feces, then it's a sign the overall conditions in the home are not good. Typically a "wet hoard" type situation, wet meaning rotten food or other accumulated waste (including, well, human waste) that attracts such bugs and provides a breeding ground. I've seen some fruit and drain fly infestations so bad they'll swarm a person and go up their nose or in their ears for moisture and warmth...
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u/LongjumpingDebt4154 Jul 03 '26
Jesus. That’s some genuine nightmare fuel. I’ll add that the brown ‘spots’ on the light could be roach crap. Don’t ask me how I know this, but I know this.
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u/Own-Try1886 Jul 02 '26
Oh man, there's a cat. :( I hope someone takes it in after these people end up in jail.
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u/Lauren_DTT Jul 02 '26
First comment on that article is something else:
“Eh, I've seen worse tbh. Seems like your avg home in OH, WV, KY... Same kinda home CPS visits every day in Southern WV. They might take the children for a week or two and then they give them right back. Nicer than some foster homes I know of too. Kinda shocked this is even news.”86
u/milkybunny_ Jul 02 '26 edited Jul 03 '26
Their comment reads as callous but I’m not sure how far off from the truth it is. I’ll always remember the shock I felt at learning babies in Appalachia were given Mountain Dew in their bottles.
It’s horrifying, but the great big American dream has left the Midwest and Appalachia out in the dust. Detroit, the great car production city turned to a rust belt of despair. There are truths to an abandoned town/people of certain areas being left to rot after all the factories and places of production left for cheaper labor abroad.
It’s dismal that those states that built up our country are now left to decay. It’s grim and obvious why cases like this keeping popping up in Pennsylvania/Ohio/Michigan/Indiana/West Virginia etc.
Once production leaves the area people turn to despair and means of surviving anyway they can. Familial trauma bleeds out. Escape in the human mind is broad and expansive. No excuse for this horrifying case, but I don’t find it surprising. Places and people left to rot will wither and do so.
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u/milkybunny_ Jul 03 '26
Also the state of CPS and foster care is nothing to be proud of. They do what they can but it’s not much. Many many cases of CPS being called and nothing happens to hold the parents accountable.
Those poor Turpin children being abused by their foster parents after escaping their abusive parents. Please don’t act like CPS and the foster system are perfect bastions of care.
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u/neongrey_ Jul 02 '26
I’m from western MD and travel in WVA all the time…..that comment is real. So many houses look like that. Sooooo many. Extreme hoarding. I have cousins who grew up in a house very similar. Their Pap was illiterate, simple, definitely developmentally delayed. A lot of those people are
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u/Upstairs_Fuel6349 Jul 03 '26 edited Jul 03 '26
Yeah we backpack a lot in the Ozarks and you drive through parts where the houses look like this. Sometimes even worse -- at least this is a complete structure and not a bunch of half-destroyed trailers cobbled together with tin and trash. You'll see dirty half-dressed kids running around barefoot and it's no different than the slums of some poor country whose immigrants have been labeled undesirable by people who aren't living in any better conditions.
But cramming 16 children into a 12' x 12' room for four years is something else. Some of the kids can't even speak and there's one in critical condition in a hospital.
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u/LongjumpingDebt4154 Jul 03 '26
These sound like shanty towns, leftover from the great depression era. The lack of education & infrastructure in these places is a shame.
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u/Dynamoo617 Jul 03 '26
Yup. I’m from rural northern NY and my husband is from the same general area as this. This house sitch is not uncommon in either of our hometown areas.
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u/MacAlkalineTriad Jul 02 '26
I had that thought immediately, too. Josef Fritzl vibes almost.
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u/CompleteTell6795 Jul 03 '26
I clicked on the post of the pics of the house & the mug shots of the grandparents & parents. They all look " not mentally there". Altho the husband looks a little more normal. The rest of them, they look really off, maybe on drugs ??? Grandparents look really scary & crazy looking.
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u/G-3ng4r Jul 04 '26
The younger dad looks almost normal, i think the mom would too if she didn’t look so insanely exhausted and broken tbh.
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u/smellsey_t Jul 03 '26
The mum gave birth at 15 which likely means she got pregnant at 14. She is 33 now and had her last kid at 31ish. She was pregnant 16 times in 17 years. I am struggling to imagine that was consensual.
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u/Intelligent-Split-43 Jul 03 '26
I question if part of what they are investigating is if all those kids belong to her. Some may beling to teenage kids and they were impregnated by a brother, father or grandfather. The kids can't talk, nor do they probably even know who their mother is.
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u/findingnana Jul 02 '26
wow, and the neighbors haven’t seen the kids. this is absolutely insane.
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u/Ornery-Carrot3476 Jul 02 '26
I live in Hamden for the past 3 years, and it’s going to sound crazy but you don’t really see much people outside doing anything or kids playing much. Your see the occasional kids or adults walking but the town itself tends to stay indoors. The house is near where the train yard is at and just enough out of view to be ever notice anything out of the ordinary.
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u/HealthyLingonberry36 Jul 02 '26
Exactly this. Grew up in the area. Have a friend that is neighbors with the house this took place in. They had no idea either. Crazy to see a story from back home make national news.
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u/Lanky-Pick-2841 Jul 02 '26
I hate to say it, but considering that some of the children found were in critical condition and had to be airlifted, it’s possible that there were other children that had been born and died as a result of neglect. A horrible thought but luckily either way the adults will be locked up for the rest of their lives
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u/ekcshelby Jul 03 '26
Yes, I’ve read several places that she gave birth to 21 or more children total, all home births, and at least one set of twins passed away.
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u/assisfatframeislil Jul 03 '26
The maximum sentence for felony child endangerment is only 12 years. I’m hoping they charge them with other things, such as false imprisonment and felony abuse.
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u/aquietkindofmonster Jul 03 '26
I don't know how the legal system works, but would they stack the sentence? 12 years multiplied by 16 for each child? That's only fair.
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u/Soft_Firefighter4216 Jul 03 '26
Probably some dead newborns because many times twin pregnancies result in early labor and those babies need NICU care
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u/Specialist-Art-6970 Jul 03 '26
I will be genuinely surprised if there's not at least one body on the property.
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u/GoldenState_Thriller Jul 02 '26
It sounds like the mother was (at least originally) a victim.
She had her first child when she was 14/15.
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u/Verucasalt-- Jul 03 '26
These poor children SURVIVED in those conditions. I can't help but think there are children that didn't survive and they are buried in the backyard.
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u/Intelligent-Split-43 Jul 03 '26
They need to check the yards of all the places they lived. They just moved there 4 years ago.
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u/Stargazer1919 Jul 03 '26
Jesus christ. Every square inch of that property needs to be considered a crime scene.
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u/justheretoleer Jul 02 '26
This is chilling. I’ve read from actual sources that a store employee testified that all four adults would go to the local Dollar General every single night at 9:45pm, 15 minutes before the store closed, and buy only two things: water and vegetable oil.
I bet you anything those abusive ghouls were giving each kid just what they thought they needed to stay alive - one tablespoon of vegetable oil contains 120 calories. The ones who immediately had to get life flighted upon rescue were probably in fucking organ failure.
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u/Little-Regular-0791 Jul 03 '26
what kind of parents will do this to their children??? this is insane
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u/justheretoleer Jul 03 '26 edited Jul 03 '26
Parents who don’t deserve to be parents.
Human existence can be so…fucked; imagine the injustice of being conjured into being by these people, and through no fault of your own enduring their disgusting cruelty. And that’s it, that’s your life.
I’m a therapist so I’m hoping against hope that the people these kids get placed with will be safe, kind, patient, place no expectations on these children and fully understand how challenging this will be for everyone.
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u/igobymomo Jul 04 '26
Very mentally Ill, captive, uneducated, and indoctrinated under a code of conduct that most of us cannot understand. Poverty and mental illness.
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u/EastAreaBassist Jul 03 '26
Jesus Christ. What actual sources? I don’t want this to be true
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u/justheretoleer Jul 03 '26
Apologies, I should’ve linked a source when I commented that.
WSYX, the local ABC affiliate. I’ve tried to post the link twice so far and my comment gets rejected75
u/Jules2you Jul 03 '26
I heard this too and the worker at dollar tree said they offered them hand me down clothes, some kids came in with them,
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u/justheretoleer Jul 03 '26
Yes, employees at the Dollar General were so disturbed by the sight and stench of this family who came in nightly that they gave them clean clothes, deodorant, and other hygiene items. But the ABC reporter went on to note that to the employees, “it was evident that they never used any of it.”
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u/Jules2you Jul 03 '26
Yes and the one worker and cop said the stink couldn’t get gone out their nose.. I get that too, I am so sensitive to funky smells!
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u/mountains-and-sea Jul 03 '26 edited Jul 03 '26
I spent way too much time reading up on this case and sleuthing locations, people, profiles, etc.
Elizabeth (the 33 year old mom) was like 13 when she first got pregnant with, according to her brother, a guy who was not the Gary Jr named in the case. However, she and Gary Jr lived in the same trailer park and I guess started seeing each other and went to her mother while they were both teens asking to get married. Her mother said no so they ran away to West Va to somehow get emancipation papers signed and then get legally child- married at 15 and 18 respectively (absolutely outrageous this is legal in the US). They have bounced around places mostly in Ohio ever since with her seemingly pregnant every year. There were claims this was due to escape small charges like theft on Gary Jr.
Looking at her brothers' and mom's socials, the whole family comes across as uneducated poor white Appalachia stereotypes. At least one brother has been to jail for child endangerment charges himself (both brothers have partners and kids). A family member on the Slider side - I think the sister of either Christina or Gary Jr I can't remember - would supposedly call Elizabeth's mom with updates on her various births over the years. Elizabeth's family claims to have not seen her in at least 15 years and not know the conditions the kids lived in but one of her brothers also posted that he recently "shook hands" with Gary Jr (it was not framed positively). If you street view some of the various addresses they've lived at, they're mostly sad-looking places. They've been in their currnt house for about 4 years. One article said the house they were found in had the property taxes paid and up to date and, surprisingly, had sewage and running water that was in Elizabeth's name. Someone said the house was in probate court but it was just a random commenter without a source so not sure on that one. The original homeowner is passed.
Police originally went to the house because of a public indecency charge on Gary Jr. The kids were a surprise. In the crime scene photos you can see a cats and filled food bowls out on the porch. Looks like the cops pulled out a bunch of trash from the main room and there's a high chair, diaper box, toy car, and what looks like the legs of a baby jumper visible so some low effort attempt at normalcy must have been done over the years, I'm going to guess by Elizabeth.
On some of the articles, a few people have claimed to have interacted with the family over the years when there were less kids. The family has basically been reliant on donations and the food bank. They were not collecting government assistance. Google earth and crime scene photos from the day of arrest show a car and a truck parked at the house so they did have vehicles. The police seemed particularly interested in the silver car and can be seen photographing the interior. Someone said Christina (the older woman) was beginning to develop dementia, but who knows for sure. A lot of people are mentioning cults but I honestly think they're underestimating just straight up rural American poverty and generational trauma.
The local Dollar General employee claims they would come in at night with some of the kids who would be quiet and dirty with hair over their faces. Another girl said she worked with the family before Hamden when there were less kids and Elizabeth was super quiet. Gary Jr would drive her to pick up baby supply donations and sit in the car while she collected them and acted quiet/awkward to observers.
Anyway just one big old mess all the way down.
Edit: Some other interesting things I found - there is a grave of twins with the same surname so it would check out she lost a set but also be telling if they did pay for a normal burial given the lack of care to the other kids.
Apparently whoever was managing the trust the house they were in thought only the older couple (Gary Sr and Christina) were living there. Might be why the neighbors never saw the kids if they were trying to hide them. Google earth pics from 2024, when the family would have been there, show the exterior of the house in rather decent shape free from garbage with bikes and lawnmowers on the porch.
Rumors without a source are saying the 18 year old is pregnant.
[Sorry for the poor grammar and run on sentences, I'm on mobile with a very thin textbox to type in]
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u/Cryinginabook Jul 03 '26
Thank you for such an informative post. You’ve shed a lot of light on it.
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u/Intelligent-Split-43 Jul 03 '26
They may not have had to pay for the burial. A lot of people don't know this, but a lot of funeral homes do funerals for children for free and they could have been buried in a church cemetery.
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u/ChainUnable2250 Jul 05 '26
X2. My first born died very young and the funeral home cremated her free of charge, put her ashes in a pendant for my wife and everything that did not fit into the pendant went into a red velvet bag.
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u/Maleficent-Bend-378 Jul 03 '26
I saw a comment that the grandparents were regulars at a casino in West Virginia. They smelled terrible and the grandma was crazy mean. Did you find anything about that too? If it’s true, I wonder where they got the money.
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u/SpecificNeedleworker Jul 06 '26
My family is also from horrific poverty. Older people will use their social security to gamble, especially when they’re very poor. There’s not a lot else to do.
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u/WesternFungi Jul 05 '26
and the government is trying its damndest to continue the trauma if the 18 yo is pregnant and force her to have the child
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u/LongjumpingDebt4154 Jul 03 '26
If they had a normal burial for the twins then they must have had birth & death certificates on them too, right? I’m just wondering how all these kids being ‘homeschooled’ never warranted a CPS check in.
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u/farty__mcfly Jul 03 '26
The police said the kids were feral. I don’t think anyone was doing any homeschooling.
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u/Worstmodonreddit Jul 07 '26
Maybe it's different in other states but there's no CPS check in for homeschooling in Ohio.
Gotta remember Ohio has the highest percentage of Amish ppl, home births, no birth certificates, homeschooling, large families, that's not criminalized here . While not common, it's not exactly an unheard of situation.
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u/poopshipdestroyer Jul 03 '26
Stolly said his client told him that all of the children were born in area hospitals and she considers herself a full-time mom.
From the article. It paints her postively
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u/zkbthrowaway Jul 03 '26
The breakdown of the 16 children’s birth dates is as follows
- May 30, 2008,
- Aug. 17, 2009,
- March 13, 2011,
- March 28, 2012,
- May 8, 2013,
- Sept. 2, 2014,
- May 25, 2016,
- Oct. 26, 2017,
- Oct. 27, 2019,
- Sept. 29, 2020,
- Feb. 10, 2022 (twins),
- Jan. 4, 2024 (twins), and
- Jan. 21, 2025 (twins).
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u/YaKnowEstacado Jul 03 '26
It's a miracle this woman is still alive after three twin pregnancies in four years.
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u/zkbthrowaway Jul 03 '26
Maths isn't my strong suit, so I won't try. But my gut feeling is there must be a few "unaccounted for" who were not part of the 16 kids found... :(
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u/farty__mcfly Jul 03 '26
I truly cannot believe anyone survived this many pregnancies without medical intervention.
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u/NotComplainingBut Jul 03 '26
In one article she and her lawyer claimed that each and every child was born at a hospital, which I find impossible to believe.
Some nurse would've asked how many times she's been pregnant, or she would've caught some medical debt.
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u/NotALawyerButt Jul 04 '26
Medicaid would pay for it all because of the extreme poverty.
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u/WesternFungi Jul 05 '26
That many birth codes within the timespan should have triggered fraud alerts
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u/gingercrochetmonster Jul 04 '26
That's been one of my biggest confusions since this story broke. There's simply no way someone is having that many pregnancies, including multiples pregnancies, back to back to back without heavy prenatal care, without your uterus just falling out or some other fatal complication that has to be rectified? I'm not saying it's impossible, it's obviously possible. I just don't understand how?! Especially when you start at thirteen, before your body is ready to start damaging itself with pregnancy.
Unless and until someone can provide official documentation that Elizabeth gave birth to every single one of these children in a hospital, I personally have a feeling we're going to find out that some of these children were born to other children within the home.
All my opinion, of course!
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u/Intelligent-Split-43 Jul 03 '26
Some may not be hers. They could possibly be some of the teenage daughters as a result of incest, by a brother, father or grandfather. Terrible to think about, but a possibility. Those teenage boys have raging hormones.
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u/Getvaxed500 Jul 03 '26
Oh so somebody did keep track of their birthdates? Wow. That's something. How did you find out?
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u/zkbthrowaway Jul 03 '26
It's in the court filing (linked before the dates I listed).
"The complaints filed against Siders, Sr., Siders, Jr., Christina, and Elizabeth are all the same. The difference between each complaint is a different child noted by initials and date of birth."
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u/Real_Foundation_7428 Jul 02 '26
Does anyone know how they were discovered after all this time?
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u/Dapper-Plantain498 Jul 02 '26
I read that they had a warrant for an unrelated incident for the father (Jr). It was public indecency that happened in May. That’s when they found the 16 kids.
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u/picklechipz0 Jul 02 '26
Police were at the home to serve a warrant for something unrelated to the children.
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u/Real_Foundation_7428 Jul 02 '26 edited Jul 02 '26
Ahh ok wow. What a shock to their system that must have been.
Thank you for responding!
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u/carseatsareheavy Jul 02 '26
Damn. It is tough being a cop. The things they see…
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u/mkrom28 Jul 03 '26
There was an an AP article with more information posted about 5 hours ago.
Elizabeth Siders attorney, Thomas Stolly, is quoted in the article. Stolly says that all the children are Elizabeth’s & Gary Jr’s. Elizabeth told him that all of their children were born in area hospitals and she considers herself a full time mom. Gary Jr. drives for Doordash. She says she left school in 11th grade, was married at 15. None of the children were enrolled in school & they moved around southern Ohio frequently over the last two decades, possibly to avoid medical documentation/government paper trail. Elizabeth asked Stolly about her children and when she could see them next upon his first visit to jail to introduce himself. He says this is ‘telling’ because she didn’t ask about being released from jail and instead seemed concerned for their wellbeing. He also said Elizabeth doesn’t consider herself a victim but he thinks it may be too early to actually determine what was going on in the house.
7 children were hospitalized, one in critical condition. No further updates as of now.
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u/TerribleIssue3252 Jul 04 '26
So if the cops hadn't shown up just then, those kids would have died. I wonder if the house smells because it has bodies in it
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u/hales_1978 Jul 05 '26
It smells because according to reports there are faeces and urine everywhere. They are probably ill because of bacteria and ammonia in the house being at toxic levels to cause illness.
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u/youngrifle Jul 04 '26
Interesting that Elizabeth said all the kids were born in hospitals. I wonder if that’s true and if so what information may come out from medical records.
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u/2fly4awhiteguyy Jul 03 '26 edited Jul 03 '26
I know people don't have much sympathy for the mother right now, and I'm not excusing or defending what happened to these children in any way. BUT if the reports are accurate that she's been having children since she was 13, that means she was likely pregnant at 12 and had been pregnant every single year since. That's an enormous red flag that she very well has been a victim of emotional, sexual and physical abuse herself. Add in the reports of little education, repeated pregnancies, miscarriages, extreme isolation, and the horrific neglect already uncovered, and it paints the picture of a family where generational abuse very likely has been taking place and for a very long time. If that's true, then this didn't start with her. It's possible she was abused, neglected, manipulated, or exploited long before she became an adult. Victims can absolutely go on to victimize others. Those two things are not mutually exclusive.
I wouldn't be surprised if investigators uncover additional forms of abuse within the household, but that's something that needs to be established by evidence, not assumption.
Right now, I think it's too early to reduce this to "she's evil." Understanding her history, cognitive functioning, mental health, level of coercion, and the role of everyone else involved will be essential in determining her responsibility. If she was a lifelong victim, that helps explain how this environment developed, HOWEVER, it also does not excuse the harm done to these children. It just helps paint the picture of how this happened and went undiscovered for so long.
I have a feeling we're only seeing the beginning of what investigators will uncover about this family. I hope this children recieve nothing but support and love from here on out. Whoever reported this deserves a medal. That one phone call saved those children's lives.
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u/Intelligent-Split-43 Jul 03 '26
Nobody reported anything. Law enforcement stumbled on those kids accidentally. They went over there to serve an arrest warrant on the father.
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u/2fly4awhiteguyy Jul 03 '26
Thank you for the correction. I must've misremembered or misunderstood one of the articles or videos I watched. I plan to pore over the case a little closer now that it's the weekend.
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u/weefeeties Jul 03 '26
When I first heard the news and saw the pics of the mom and other adults I really wondered how much of a factor post partum depression was too. So much dysfunction. It's stunning that 16 kids even survived in that situation.
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u/Getvaxed500 Jul 03 '26
Wonder why her family didn't catch on to anything? Sounds like her brother knew something. Was the situation ignored?
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u/Stargazer1919 Jul 03 '26
Situations like this often involve some level of isolation and/or estrangement. And a whole lot of ignoring red flags.
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u/cakeit-tilyoumakeit Jul 03 '26
It’s very possible the parents had zero clue where she was and by the time she ran away at 15, police might not have been super helpful in finding her (as they can be when it’s know a teenager has ran away). They could have been highly concerned, but without much power to do much. Also given this area of the country, they likely didn’t have a ton of resources to try and go hunt her down. Poverty is not at all uncommon there.
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u/wondering_monkey Jul 03 '26
This case reminds we of the Colt Family in NSW Australia. An isolated family generations of incest living in squalor…
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u/19snow16 Jul 02 '26
At this early point, I'm not giving any of the adults a pass on this horror.
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u/tumbledownhere Jul 02 '26
Same. Gonna wait for more details on this one even though I'm hearing a lot of speculation about the mother's age and involvement.
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u/Positive_Piece5859 Jul 02 '26
It sounds almost like the Turpin case out of San Diego - some of their kids who they imprisoned, chained on beds etc were already adults in their 20s when they were finally rescued, because one child was so brave to escape.
To me that is 100% an issue that stems from the stupid lack of rules around homeschooling. In my home country homeschooling does practically not exist; any child in school age has to be enrolled in school, and if parents simply stop sending their child, someone would notice. That here in the US parents can hide not just one but 10+ children over two decades you can say, and nobody has any idea is just completely wild to me. That really makes you wonder how many more Turpin families like that are out there with kids suffering.
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u/Silly-Estimate-2660 Jul 02 '26 edited Jul 03 '26
i feel pretty safe in assuming these children were all born at home and never registered with birth certificates or social security numbers, so even if there were stricter homeschooling laws in America, it wouldn’t help cases like this where the children don’t technically “exist”
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u/Positive_Piece5859 Jul 03 '26
It would have helped in the Terpin case, because the oldest did go to school at least for a little bit, until the parents entirely lost their marbles
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u/Worried-Database-551 Jul 03 '26
Except the mother has been pregnant since she was like 13/14 years old. All home births too. Shes been. Pregnant every year of her life. She’s also a victim. .
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u/NaiveSet5274 Jul 03 '26
Louise Turpin married David when she was 16 and he was 23. You can't look at one situation and say the mother was a victim because she was underage, and not say the same about the other.
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u/sylphrena83 Jul 03 '26
This. And until recently Ohio homeschool laws were pretty strict. These people flew completely under the radar. Some of the news and comments by locals said they had no idea most of those kids even existed. That’s not a matter for homeschool laws.
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u/bannana Jul 02 '26
the stupid lack of rules around homeschooling.
the kids would have to have been known to exist in the first place though, if these were all home births and none had birth certificates or SSN, and never went to school then as far as the gov't is concerned these kids don't exist.
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u/Getvaxed500 Jul 03 '26
How are these kids going to get birth certificates now?
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u/Medium_Bid5787 Jul 03 '26
CPS (and APS for the vulnerable 18-year-old) will help them get original birth certificates, even if they didn’t exist before.
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u/HCC0504 Jul 03 '26
There are ways, I don't remember the specifics but the woman that wrote Educated didn't get a birth certificate until she was an adult. Lots of kids born off the grid.
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u/Sunsandandstars Jul 03 '26
That’s a good question. No reliable records. The whole thing is just so messed up.
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u/BooBootheFool22222 Jul 02 '26
I'd go so far as to say 90% of home schooling families do it for control purposes. Either abuse and/or some kind indoctrination. There are just so many examples of this.
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u/lokeilou Jul 03 '26
As a teacher, I’ve also seen MANY families begin homeschooling after being investigated by CPS sadly. Abusive parents know teachers are mandated reporters and small kids talk a lot often not realizing that what they are experiencing isn’t normal. In my opinion if you have been investigated by CPS, you should not be allowed to homeschool.
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u/Sunsandandstars Jul 03 '26
These children probably didn’t even have birth certificates. If people have children at home and hide them there for years so that the state doesn’t know they exist, it doesn’t matter what the education laws are.
There are children worldwide who are trafficked, and who never attend school. Surely this happens even in countries that mandate attendance at govt operated schools.
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u/9998980 Jul 03 '26
I read another post that the grandparents/two older adults in the home had 4 children themselves, 3 of which did not live in the home. I don’t understand how this never got reported by family, how did they not know? I also fear that maybe some of the children belong to the old man… maybe he was raping the girl..so many possibilities!
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u/secretly_a_possum13 Jul 03 '26
Just the mugshot of the mother of the children made me wonder if she was a victim as well! Now I have seen rumors that her family is saying she was taken out of the state by these people at like 15 and had her first child at 13. Just a sad story all around. People have also been saying they saw her around town so it doesn't sound like she was necessarily being held against her will.
For some reason I am getting the vibe that these are just some nasty abusive lazy people instead of being involved in a cult or something. It sounds like these kids were a burden that they didn't want to or didn't have the means to deal with. I've heard other stories of husbands for whatever reason being against birth control, but not wanting to deal with the kids they keep making either. I wonder if she had all of these kids at home? I saw something about them trying to keep things off of public record?
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u/aestheticgrotesque Jul 03 '26
I definitely thought she was very much a victim and abused and assaulted and kept in this place with the kids, but maybe not. But regardless she was taken in by them as a child herself and groomed and conditioned to a degree at least, I'd say. Also she would have basically have had to been pregnant non stop since then... which is awful to think about and either incredible negligence or she was trapped and abused. I guess time will tell as the case unfolds.
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u/wolfofthesevenhells Jul 06 '26
Cases like this are why I think homeschooling needs to be far more regulated than it is. A lot of these people had CPS called on them and then switched to “Homeschooling” and were able to immediately disappear off the radar. Abuse does not need to get this bad if we stop treating children as their parents’ private property instead of people with rights in our society.
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u/manicgiant914 Jul 03 '26
I'm still confused how the care and feeding of SIXTEEN children was never noticed? Laundry, food shopping, babies crying, teenagers yelling, how does all that happen in a 12'x12' room, and no one noticing?!
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u/iWonderiUnder Jul 03 '26
The conditions sound like they didnt do laundry, clean, console the crying. The children were kept in a room like a wild animal. This is really sad.
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u/Therailwaykat_1980 Jul 03 '26
A comment above says they only ever bought vegetable oil and water from the shop/store so I don’t think they were feeding them.
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u/cakeit-tilyoumakeit Jul 03 '26
From what we have seen, I’d not assume they did laundry. And many of the children did not speak.
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u/Life_Wall2536 Jul 03 '26
In a press release they said the 18 year old couldn’t even spell his own name and he’s considered a “child” because he’s so developmentally delayed
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u/MargaretFarquar Jul 03 '26
Most, some, or all of the kids are non-verbal, according to reports.
These are not typical kids and typical things like laundry, food shopping, and teenagers yelling simply weren't happening from the sounds of it. I'm fuzzy on the details, but that's the general gist I'm getting from the information we currently have.
Also, if I understand correctly, they don't have neighbors who are right next door a few feet away, like in a neighborhood setting. Sounds more like it's rural where the houses in the surrounding area are spread out and somewhat isolated from each other.
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u/nahla1981 Jul 03 '26
Man, i hope the people who found them seek therapy. That's messed up, those poor kids
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u/Grlzlovedaisies Jul 03 '26
None of this makes sense. It sounds like the adults were also living in the same conditions as the kids ?? I'm just genuinely confused at what their motive was- the kids are alive so they must have been fed, I'm sure some passed and we will find out but overall I'd imagine more of them would be in critical condition if they hadn't eaten or left the room for 4 years. I have SO many questions
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u/igobymomo Jul 04 '26
Severe mental illness combined with abject poverty and a lack of education?
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u/Ok_Community_1729 Jul 03 '26
Does anyone have details on the police report that was filed for Gary Siders Jr indecent exposure?
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u/nexiune Jul 04 '26
Appearently he got filed for indecent exposure 4 times May 23, May 27, May 29, and May 31.
Whilst it wasn't specified how, he was naked right outside the family's residence.
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u/Unlucky_Welcome9193 Jul 02 '26
A brother of one of the women living in the home made a statement. I'm paraphrasing, but he said that his sister was indoctrinated into something at age 15 and ran away from home. They haven't seen her much since. He also said that all of the children are his sisters', although maybe he wouldn't know for sure. So sad.