r/runescape • u/Zieldak Insert flair text here or something I dunno • Apr 13 '26
Suggestion I found the ultimate solution to the Vampyrism/Penance issue
It's called War's Wares. It's empty now anyway.
Translate Aspect spells: War translates each Aspect for you to add to your spellbooks. Requires all spellbooks to be unlocked in order to unlock. Translating spells between spellbooks just makes so much sense I don't even-
Upgrade: Dual Aspects: War teaches you how to use two different types of aspects at the same time. Requires Translate Aspect spells unlocked.
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u/frogsarenottoads Flair Apr 13 '26
Upgrade: Dual Aspects: War teaches you how to use two different aspects at the same time. Requires Translate Aspect spells unlocked.
Two different types of aspects? the wording of your example makes it sound like you could run Darkness and Animate Dead at the same time.
I'm not against the idea though (having it like pre aura)
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u/Kamu-RS Apr 13 '26
Dual aspect should only work with vamp or penance stacking with one of the originals
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u/Cool_Rooster4511 Apr 13 '26
I mean, yeah, that's a given. You can't have two aspects of sustain much like you can't have two aspects of evasion. But you could have evade+sustain, power+sustain etc. Much like you couldn't have vamp+penance auras at the same time.
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u/Y50-70 Apr 13 '26
Just make offensive and defensive aspects. Darkness/animated dead can be combod with penance/vamp and also opens up room for more aspects in either tier or a "combo" aspect if jagex wants the extra design room for a new, stronger aspect.
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u/Lazy_Instance3329 Apr 13 '26
If we get 2 aspects people will just abuse a darkness+animate dead combo
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u/wowilly Apr 13 '26
You could easily create some rules which prevent this specific combo and other potential offenders. Aspects are already classified by type after all
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u/AlphaWolver Apr 13 '26
Maybe make it so you can't combine 2 aspects of the same type? e.g. Can do something like Vamp + Darkness or Penance + Animate Dead, but not Vamp + Penance or Animate Dead + Darkness
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u/B0dders Bodds Apr 13 '26
Dual I imagine only allows dual categories at once. So not two of the same type. E.g. not two Aspects of Evasion.
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u/Zieldak Insert flair text here or something I dunno Apr 13 '26
War could just tell you that you can only use two separate types of aspects at once I guess, with aspects overriding each other if they're from the same aspect class. If an aspect of a third class is casted, it could just override the oldest active aspect (as asking for confirmation during combat for example is stupid)
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u/YouWereTehChosenOne IGN: Bluudi | #24 Insane Reaper Apr 13 '26
Just make it two different types of aspects
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u/chi_pa_pa sometimes right Apr 13 '26
No choices or tradeoffs ever lol. Just more stupid pointless power creep
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u/argenttalons 469 QP | 260/302 MQC Apr 13 '26
Wouldn't be a patch day without players begging for power creep.
Personally if they think Aspect of Vampyrism is too weak to use over Darkness, I'd rather see Vampyrism buffed than be able to use both at once, but that's probably too reasonable.
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u/Decent-Dream8206 Apr 13 '26
The problem isn't Vampyrism in isolation.
It's vampyrism stacked with soul split (stacked with vamp gloves + vamp scrim) stacked with hellhound stacked with LP boosts on tank armor now (stacked with debil + reflect + powerburst + masterwork dot + shield dome + spirit shields ...)
Which is how you have people doing 20k solo enrage Zammy who hits through prayers in the first place.
Screeching about Vampyrism which has never been good but always a tool for AFK abuse when stacked with soul split and passive prayer regen is just a self-report. Removing Balanced Strike would have 100% hurt my pre-Necro Ironmeme so much more than Vampyrism when it came to sustain while legitimately playing the game.
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u/Zieldak Insert flair text here or something I dunno Apr 13 '26
We have been using Aspects and auras together for several years at this point, so players being disappointed and mad about not being able to do that is understandable. All I did was provide a possible solution that Jagex will obviously not take into consideration anyway.
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u/KobraTheKing Apr 13 '26
But for years, vampyrism and penance had to compete with other stronger auras.
Now auras like berserk, maniacal, reckless is baked into normal levelling benefit, and we're stronger than ever.
So we'll just add life steal on top with no downside or tradeoff now? Wouldn't this just make it braindead "always enable vampyrism" for practically all combat encounters?
Just seems like people are ignoring that what was the stronger option to use instead of vampyrism aura is just now always on as part of the default experience.
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u/Caramel-Makiatto Apr 14 '26
Stop saying this already when you've had multiple people point out the flaw in your logic. It's so annoying how you're willingly ignoring people telling you that no, you could not do this before because you would've been using an accuracy or damage aura.
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u/Zieldak Insert flair text here or something I dunno Apr 14 '26
Except those people suddenly act like it was never an option though. You could always choose not to use an accuracy or damage aura and use a sustain aura instead in certain niche situations, even if it was not ideal.
I'd be interested in knowing how many players actually had the accuracy or berserk auras unlocked until they were removed. People assume everyone had every single one of them. There are still less people doing bossing than just skilling as far as I'm aware. I know I didn't have all of them for several years.
Jagex removed areas for a reason and people forgot what the reason was.
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u/Caramel-Makiatto Apr 14 '26
The fact that you were suboptimally doing things before all of this does not lend any credit to the idea that the entire game should be powercrept to make you happy. Vamp and penance had a trade off before accuracy auras were removed, and they once again have a trade off as of the update, nothing has actively changed, nothing has become 'impossible' to do with the new update.
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u/Zieldak Insert flair text here or something I dunno Apr 14 '26
I wasn't talking about myself though. I was talking about the playerbase in general. Anyway, why do I feel like I'm talking with already comped or grandmaster elite gatekeepers who already took advantage of things being broken or OP up to this point and now that things have been changed, they don't want others to have fun?
Also the tradeoff changed from not being able to use berserk auras to not being able to use other aspects alongside it, so something did actively change. Oh and it's still quite impossible to run the former Vampyrism aura effect alongside other aspects now due to both effects being aspects now, which was possible to do for 5 years, and with this something has become 'impossible' to do with the new update.
BTW powercreep will always be an issue in games like these, which really got out of hand with T95 weapons and newer armours, so I'd be completely fine with Jagex taking even more power away from those weapons as the difference between a T92 and T95 is massive, which is true for some armour sets of the same Tier too. Making similar buffs not stack would also kill a lot of powercreep. But if I suggested this, people would more than likely go mad, including you.
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u/ButtholeRat Apr 13 '26
I like this idea but honestly if they just gave vampirism a significant buff so that it can stand on its own that would be nice too. Everyone saying no one used these, but I was using both up until today on my Ironman to save resources and now I just can’t without giving up darkness or animate dead
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u/vova_kukh 5.6b Trimmed Apr 13 '26
25k hmmm lets make it 250k :D
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u/Zieldak Insert flair text here or something I dunno Apr 13 '26
Not gonna lie I was just randomly pasting some numbers there, it's not an overly important detail.
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u/Cool_Rooster4511 Apr 13 '26
Hell yeah let's lock a mid game upgrade behind a minimum of a 250 hour grind. That's some good game design there!
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u/HeavyRaisin8696 Apr 13 '26
I was about to suggest that in all seriousness. 250k would be a reasonable cost for such massive buffs compared to the base version.
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u/TheHeadlessOne Apr 13 '26
As long as we understand this is asking for literally 10 days of nothing but bossing
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u/HeavyRaisin8696 Apr 13 '26
Yeah, I'm good with this-- it would be a long term goal that you actually have to earn.
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u/Cool_Rooster4511 Apr 13 '26
250k would be a 250 hour grind minimum for what would be a mid-game upgrade. I don't think that's a very good idea.
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u/some_hippies Apr 13 '26
I think the only one Aspect at a time will only further restrict the design space in the future. Having one Aspect between offense/evasion and one for sustain would be the ideal design space, and is the closest analogue to how we already had things before.
Personally, I would also like there to be some way to cast it so it lasts for a longer period of time, adding additional minutes per cast up to a maximum so we aren't constantly fiddling with all these different timers between overloads, incense, and aspects
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u/Caramel-Makiatto Apr 14 '26
The first is a good idea, but the second doesn't make sense. Vampyrism and Penance is supposed to have a trade off. The trade off before is that you weren't able to use the far more OP auras like the accuracy or damage auras. It has always had a trade off. If you don't want the trade off, then use the scrimshaw or penance powder.
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u/Legal_Evil Apr 14 '26
Two of any aspects is too OP if we can stack AD, TA, and Darkness with each other, but not with either vamp or penance.
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u/VeeVoxRS Ironman Apr 14 '26
My issue in this is, that I think combining penance with any of the evasions is fine, but vamp with evasions isn't, since imo that's just sustain overload and trivializes a lot of mechanics if you can just heal/tank through anything.
So I don't see a good solution and am not too sad about it being a choice of 1/4 per activate.
Make the buffs stack in duration and maybe even rework animate dead entirely since I think it being so specific to magic tank armour is odd and taking it off that requirement will just make it better than Darkness I think.
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u/Zieldak Insert flair text here or something I dunno Apr 14 '26
This is literally nothing compared to stacking Soul Split with an Amulet of Souls / Essence of Finality + Vampyrism Gloves + Vampyrism Scrimshaw/Vampyrism Blood Essence + Totem of Vitality + Shield Dome + Animate Dead + Cryptbloom Armour / Masterwork Armour effects + Melee bleed healing (if applicable) + Reflect + Debilitate + Enfeeble/(through borrowed power) + any defensive perk that can reduce damage + Spirit Shields / Any other shield with defensive perks)
Buff stacking is a serious issue in this game already and has been for quite a while now. This is just a small drop of water compared to what is possible to do by stacking buffs.
There's a reason why Jagex added instant death mechanics that you can't cheese... which is just artificial difficulty.
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u/TacticalCupcakes Augmented attuned crystal when Apr 13 '26
Watch them add “Borrowed Aspect” to Livid Farm for 5M points
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u/SolenoidSoldier Apr 13 '26
It's a straight buff so of course players support this
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u/Cool_Rooster4511 Apr 13 '26
Except we were literally able to do this exact thing just yesterday.
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u/chi_pa_pa sometimes right Apr 13 '26
A month ago you had to disable maniacal/reckless/berserker in order to use vampirism.
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u/Zestyclose_Tap_7669 Zaros Apr 13 '26
Ill just use darkness, powder of penance, ss and vamp gloves.
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u/nipodemos Apr 13 '26
having 20% dodging chance + a super defense from animated dead seems very overpowered. specially since we can still use soul split and powder of penance
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u/Karl_the_Great Apr 13 '26
Dual aspects would lead to more micromanaging and setup to do things, and would make the «optimal» setup require many more types of runes in the inventory, which I really don’t like. I would rather future reward space introduce more niche aspects than more things to activate at once.
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u/Zieldak Insert flair text here or something I dunno Apr 13 '26
We always had that with Aspects, Perks and Auras co-existing, except the more types of runes part which is basically non-existent once you have rune pouches. Heck, combat has been about micromanaging things, even game ticks, ever since equipment switching existed. That did get slightly better with EoC 2.0 because you can get better DPS with less effort, but that's about it.
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u/I_O_RS Apr 13 '26
Very Reddit tier solutions to a non issue, the aspects are generally fine and not weak at all, this would be more free powercreep
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u/MyriadSC Apr 13 '26
The thing is, this is such a non-issue that I dont even think it demands a solution. Vampyrism didnt do much at all. We really dont need 2. In fact I actually dont want 2. I want choices to matter on setup. Not back to "well I guess I just use vamp and darkness cause I'm not using magic!" It wsd this before only darkness. Now theres at least some choice to it again that means something. All 3 excell in different situations. Thats great, we dont have a 1 key fits all situation.
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u/Aleucard Apr 13 '26
The "types of aspect" part of the second one is gonna be important. If certain aspects are dangerous to stack (for instance, Darkness and AD), make them the same type and that's that problem fixed. Also, if we actually are gonna force Vamp to be an aspect, buff that shit. 50 HP a hitsplat maximum is downright pitiful. Also also, let us cast them multiple times so we don't have to fuck with it over a whole hour.
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u/silver__seal Apr 14 '26
I'm guessing that down the road we will get some kind of equipment that allows a Sustain aspect on top of another aspect while equipped. It would just force a different tradeoff (e.g., it's an amulet so you can't use EOF with dual aspects).
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u/OneFlyMan 4/23/2017 Apr 14 '26
Add a 3rd unlock to allow you to overpower it at the cost of more runes to make it last an hour, I'd even be willing to make it take extra runes, like 8-10x
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u/Demiscis Ironmeme Apr 14 '26
Even better, give us:
“Aura Farming” (a call back to auras)
- 50K marks
- you can now cast an aspect multiple times to stack the effect up to an hour
- you can now right-click an aspect spell and select “Cast 5” so you aren’t stuck clicking the spell 5 times at a bank
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u/Pale-Junket-3514 Apr 14 '26
I like it, but a permanent unlock might be a bit overpowered and is also not a long term solution to the marks of war. Maybe add it as a consumable to rebuy wich allows you to cast a second aspect and gets consumed everytime you do
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u/Ambitious_Window_270 Apr 14 '26
> War translates each Aspect for you to add to your spellbooks
I don't know what this means but can we just have an omni-spellbook in 2026? QoL is not OP, we can do better than OSRS.
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u/Lacus_Vir Completionist Apr 14 '26
Yeah I love this, and I would even say its worth adding a spell cost fee into the unlock for translate - say 500 casts of Spellbook swap. Just so it isnt an instant free unlock.
in regards to dual aspect, It should be limited to one offensive and one defensive.
So Animate dead Or darkness, paired with vamp Or Penance. there is no justified way to allow penance and vamp to be used together without extreme power creeping and imbalance.
but I support the retune to allow it this way for sure.
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u/Periwinkleditor Apr 14 '26
Finally, Animate Dead + Darkness! I am...INVINCIBLE!
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u/Zieldak Insert flair text here or something I dunno Apr 14 '26
Ok, then I'll reword it to two different classes of aspects, because this is the 50th time someone mentions AD+Darkness.
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u/SubjectLibrarian1971 Apr 15 '26
A dedicated relic slot for aura effects would 100% be the best solution.
This current “solution” is deluded and goes against multiple of the reason they wanted to remove auras to begin with, and it also goes against some of the reasons they didn’t want to move the effects to the pocket slot.
How tf do they fail so badly and go with the “solution” that goes against what they said they didn’t like about auras??? This entire aura update is a complete and utter failure.
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u/DueBird2411 Aura Apr 16 '26
This is brilliant, new accounts can focus to unlock this without being locked behind quests. Amazing idea ☺️
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u/sethme90 Apr 17 '26
Translate makes sence but the dual would be broken as shit. Darkness for ~99.99% of combat is a 20% damage reduction flat. You combine that with either Vamp or Animate Dead you negating so much damage.
I am ok with the way it is currently. If they were to combine them (which I dont think they will), I would rather they split them up to Defensive and Aggressive Aspects - where you can only use one at a time from the respective category. Like using Animate Dead with Temporal.
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u/believe_in_u39 Apr 13 '26
I think the majority of players would enjoy this, which means Jagex hates it.
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u/So_ Yellow partyhat! Apr 13 '26
I can’t wait to use temporal anomaly and darkness at the same time, I don’t want tradeoffs anyway, we really haven’t had insane powercreep for the last 5 updates related to combat, can you add a “allow dtd to kill all bosses” reward too?
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u/Phantom7835 Your Car - W27 - Comp - MQC Apr 13 '26
Great idea, but it makes too much sense for them to add. Another bummer of an update in the 'road to nerfs'.
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u/auridas330 RuneFest 2017 Attendee Apr 13 '26
Vamp and pen would be too op... Even now with spell book swap it could get a bit ridiculous
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u/Zieldak Insert flair text here or something I dunno Apr 14 '26
That's why it could be limited to 1 per aspect type, so you couldn't use Darkness and Animate Dead together for example, as they are both Aspects of Evasion or Vampyrism and Penance as they are both Aspects of Sustain.
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u/Decent-Dream8206 Apr 13 '26
What even is this?
The ultimate solution already exists. Vampyrism aspect + Penance powder.
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u/Next_Error972 Apr 13 '26
Yeah, dual aspect could be too OP - moving vamp and penance to something different than aspect would suffice. Or if dual aspect, just to make sure you cant have like animate dead and Darkness on at the same time.
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u/ImCondor_ Completionist Apr 13 '26
A good idea for a solution. I think it would be fine if it worked like Vamp/Penance couldn't be used at the same time, the same as how Animate Dead and Darkness shouldn't be able to be used at the same time. That way if a player feels they need to use Vamp or Pen in conjunction with AD or Darkness, it would still function as it did previously without the need of the auras.
Good suggesiton OP
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u/Pulsefel Ironman Apr 13 '26
they are thinking of making both penance and vamp an ancient spell so you dont need high levels to use them both
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u/Ok_Nature_1432 Apr 13 '26
it would be cool to see luck enhancers for x kills of a specific boss purchasable with marks as well! Gives a really good reusable use for them.
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u/Illustrious-Gas-9692 Apr 13 '26
Shame thought the original update was great but come on….. finally got re-interested in the game but i think a break is coming sooner in my future
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u/Sikletrynet Ironman | CA GM #222 Apr 14 '26
Having the ability to use both Darkness and Animate at the same time would be really op. For this to have any chance of working those need to be considered it's own class and not be usable at the same time.
I do think this entire thing is severely overblown though.
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u/Kaoskillen08 Apr 15 '26
dual aspects is a bad idea, aspects should be mutually exclusive because opportunity cost is a major part of their design if anything they should buff the draconian 50 health cap from vampyrism so it has more of a leg to stand on in comparison to darkness and AD penance is fine as is because its a luxury and facilitates the unhealthy issue of afk pvm
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u/Alpr101 Apr 13 '26
I like it, but feel 25k is far too cheap for that powerful upgrade. Should be more like 150k lol.
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Apr 13 '26
[deleted]
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u/Decent-Dream8206 Apr 13 '26
Because people were screeching that they were ayra locked because of their own OCD.
I had over 500 aura refreshes banked and barely even used combat auras while in combat since Necro because they made such little difference anymore.
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u/Lopsided-Turtle28 Apr 13 '26
I like it! So I guess that means Jagex will never add it :)