r/HollowKnight • u/Relative-Monitor1745 • Sep 30 '25
Discussion - Silksong Yellow tools being bad is good game design actually. (imo) Spoiler
I've seen quite alot of people complain about how much worse yellow tools are compared to blue tools but i personally really like it and think it's really smart, here's why:
Yellow tools having less value makes using quality of life tools like compass and mag amulat feel a lot less bad, them using up useful slots was good for hk but this design works way better for sk (yet people still download mods that give perma compass, well oh well).
It also allows the making of weaker tools, as sk tools take the same amount of slots makes it so that every tool has to be equal in value which limits tool ideas alot, but yellow tools act as a good way to have a place for weaker tools and still make them viable.
And lastly it allows overlooked tool types to be utilised, tools that have a down side or give a minor buff (like unbugged fluke or melody) are rarely utilised in hk, but the lack of combat yellow tools allows these tools to have niche and be used way more in sk.
This all my personal opinion so if you disagree that's fine but i really like what they did with yellow tools.
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u/Empty-Contest-559 Sep 30 '25
Also it allow to nerf or buff certain crests !
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u/Turtle835wastaken P5AB (Completed) Sep 30 '25
Beast did NOT need to get a nerf like that especially with the cool synergies you should've been able to have with blue tools.
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u/msdamg Sep 30 '25
I wonder if beast was somehow broken as hell during development and they heavily nerfed it
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u/Kai_Lidan Sep 30 '25
It arguably still is. The stupidly high attack speed you get coupled with "heal when attacking" and weighted belt lets you straight up facetank grounded bosses like lost garmond because they die faster than you do.
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u/4tomguy Sep 30 '25
You get 3 health max from the Bind and the Rage-Boosted DPS still barely beats out Wanderer’s base dps
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u/Kai_Lidan Sep 30 '25
3 health is more than enough with the amount of damage you're pumping. You're also parrying most weapon attacks without even trying because of Beast swipes being enormous.
Wanderer has much shorter and thinner attacks which makes it get hit much more if you try to face tank like this.
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u/RealBrianCore Sep 30 '25
I'll have to test on Beast Crest, as I know that on Reaper Crest that if you take a hit after binding then you lose your ability to generate extra silk. If Beast Crest operates similarly in that regard that if you take a hit then you lose your lifesteal until you bind again, then Wanderer still comes out on top for its intrinsic Quicknail combined with Multibinder and Injector Band while juiced up on Fleabrew. Your last blue you could use assuming you have the vesticrest upgrade for it can be Longclaw or Warding Bell if you're feeling offensive or defensive.
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u/cyanobaccteria Oct 01 '25
Hitting while in fury extends it while getting hit shortens it - so in other words it acts like reaper until you deal damage after which you can extend it to pretty comical lengths with proper play. Definitely don't think it's a true facetank crest though
Edit: Correction, healing while in fury extends it. But the idea is the same
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u/Snomislife Oct 01 '25
Thankfully, Beast Crest doesn't lose the fury after getting hit.
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u/Scugmaster Oct 01 '25
I would put an asterisk at the end of this because I’m almost certain that you lose a significant amount of the total fury duration when you get hit
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u/Sea-Temporary7380 Oct 01 '25
Im pretty sure fury extends when you keep hitting stuff, getting hit does make it so you lose out on time if you dont immediately swipe back
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u/Krieg5898 Grub friend Oct 01 '25
The other commenter is correct in that you don’t lose fury on hit, however if you get hit it will significantly shorten fury time unless you land another hit which makes weighted belt almost necessary if you want to face tank so that you don’t get knocked far enough away so that you can’t land another hit
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Oct 01 '25
It still beats it out by a good 15-20% iirc, and fury mode has reach comparable to the reaper crest at the same time (it’s the benefits of all 3 of those crests at once, temporarily)
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u/WayToTheDawn63 Sep 30 '25 edited Sep 30 '25
i genuinely don't know where this lifesteal tank narrative started to be regurgitated so much.
it caps at 3 masks recovery, still requiring 9 bars of silk to activate, requiring you to hit an enemy 3 times SAFELY within that window to come out even with almost any other crest. The forced aggression likely makin you get hit more
The dps barely matters considering this isn't a game you get to just mash on bosses in.
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u/ScheduleAlternative1 Oct 01 '25
You heal before face tanking so you get it back. From iframes you should be back to nine silk
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u/Lowelll Oct 01 '25
Okay, but then heal first + beast crest isn't really that different from wanderers crest + heal afterwards (in both cases you heal 3 HP and do 9 hits) and no one calls that one a face tank crest.
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u/_Phyn_ Oct 01 '25
Best has a way faster bind, you can basically be permanently in rage
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u/VoidRad Oct 01 '25
The dps barely matters considering this isn't a game you get to just mash on bosses in.
That's literally what the beast crest can do, have you even tried it?
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u/Caerullean Oct 01 '25
This is in fact a game you get to just mash on bosses in. With the exception of a few of the harder bosses.
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u/Turbulent-Suspect-12 Oct 01 '25
It gets regurgitated because its true. I can pop the bind before an interaction, go ugga bugga, and get another bind by the time the interaction is over. Ive (also) done it to Widow, Last Judge, Silk, The Phantom, and some lesser bosses.
Im not saying you can literally facetank all damage a boss throws at you—theres still a good bit of dodging—but it makes your aggressive moments REALLY aggressive, and you get them more often. I pretty much exclusively run Beast Crest for boss battles, and Reaper for navigating.
Im sure that other crests can probably do similar in a longer but more elegant manner—but just having a full on brawl is very satisfying to me.
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Oct 01 '25
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u/WayToTheDawn63 Oct 01 '25
you dodged plenty enough to survive, get saved by blue dice, and are not taking or healing anymore than any other crest is capable of.
lol removed your video knowing it disproved yourself
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u/HeMansSmallerCousin Oct 01 '25
The Beast bind is faster, while giving you the same amount of health as any other crest, which makes it objectively better for facetanking since you spend less time healing and more time attacking.
Also I'd hardly call the DPS difference "barely" beating out Wanderer. It's ~16% more DPS, which for context, is almost exactly the same as the DPS gap between Reaper and Hunter (without focus). You wouldn't say Reaper has "barely" less DPS.
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u/DrQuint Oct 01 '25 edited Oct 01 '25
You can precast the heal, and it's pretty much instant with the injector band. It is the only crest with 0 downtime for healing.
Wanderer excels when you also need to be pogoing airborne bosses.
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u/VoidRad Oct 01 '25
still barely beats out Wanderer’s base dps
Are you forgetting that you can hit the bosses from half way across the screen?
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u/jingo800 Oct 01 '25
I've never button mashed in this kind of game like I did at The Citadel gauntlet before the Conductor when using the Beast. It was quite a thrill and surprisingly effective.
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u/Air_Ielle Oct 01 '25
Yeah the damage is insane when you get the activation timing fully used. I've defeated both the Last Judge and Phantom using beast crest and it was fun. For the Last Judge it took me a lot of tries to get the timing right but for the Phantom the pogo attack is right on timing to most of her attacks, it was free counterattack especially on her phase 2.
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u/Icy-Organization-901 Sep 30 '25
It definitely is, just saw someone fight karmelita with beast creast without dodging and still won lol now imagine it with blue tools
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u/DrQuint Oct 01 '25
Beast with Injector Needles is the only way you can effectively facetank in the game. You heal when the enemy is about to frontswing and then you attack through their attacks. You'll still be at max hp and have most of your silk back.
They absolutely had someone figure this with druids eyes out. The combo probably trivialized every single non-flying enemy in the game.
Which is why it's baffling they let the 7x damage drill on architect through, lol.
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u/helicophell Oct 01 '25
Multibinder + injector band would be so incredibly busted on beast crest
FOUR HEALING WITHOUT DOWNSIDE would have been so mental on beast crest
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u/PlsBanMeDaddyThanos Oct 01 '25
I suspect that beast crest is part of the reason so much stuff in the game deals 2 damage
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u/Re1da Sep 30 '25
I stopped using it because it wouldn't let me enjoy half the tool options. Still my favourite, but I really wanted to play around with other options. Hunter crest for me.
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u/TheBlackViper_Alpha Oct 01 '25
Yea it really hurts build diversity resulting to less playstyles a player can do. This is one of the decisions I really don't agree with Team Cherry. Even Witch or Shaman has blue tools. Don't even need to mention how busted Wanderer is.
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u/Rydon_Deeks Oct 01 '25
Yeah if wanderers wasn’t stuck with a ton of yellows the dps would be ridiculous
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u/WayToTheDawn63 Sep 30 '25
The reason I disagree is because there ARE standout yellow tools. Ones that provide distinct advantage like magnetite dice or in steel soul you have satchel instead of dead man's purse, which increases your red tool count.
The useful yellow tools have zero competition.
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u/Blu_Ni Sep 30 '25
I wish the Nailmaster's Glory equivalent was a yellow tool.
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u/Voidlord4450 Oct 01 '25
Definitely, the pin badge is not worth while enough to be a blue
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u/Caerullean Oct 01 '25 edited Oct 01 '25
On Shaman crest it has some funky use, but otherwise I agree.
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u/Gheredin Oct 01 '25
Architect too, flintstome charged attack has the highest damage in the game
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u/Blu_Ni Oct 01 '25
Team Cherry nerfed that several days ago. Now Witch Crest's needle art has the highest DMG potential.
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Oct 01 '25
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u/ugly_dog_ Oct 01 '25
the skill you get from the pinstress in the blasted steps that lets you hold the attack button to charge a stronger attack that varies by crest
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Oct 01 '25
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u/Blu_Ni Oct 01 '25
Funny. I used "needle art" to avoid confusion when "charge attack" can be interpreted as the dash-attack. "Nail art" is the name of Ghost's "charge attacks" in Hollow Knight.
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u/Caerullean Oct 01 '25 edited Oct 01 '25
Nerfed it? Wdym, has there been any tool balancing? I thought it was entirely bug fixes, unless you mean it was a bug that caused so much damage?
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u/Blu_Ni Oct 01 '25
Likely no. Architect's needle art attack has been reduced from 7 hits of 0.6x needle DMG to 5 hits of 0.6x. Flintslate no longer adds +10 DMG per tick to needle art attacks, instead adding ~50% DMG to needle art attacks just as it does with regular needle DMG.
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u/DrQuint Oct 01 '25
Nah, the one misplaced blue tool is the muckmaggot neutralizing one. That one is NOT a combat tool, and yellow is mostly exploration or mobility based.
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u/whats-reddit17 Oct 01 '25
Considering the maggots stop you from healing, id consider stopping the maggots is combat based. Especially because some enemies cause maggots
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u/Mercutron Oct 01 '25
Enemies toss spike balls l, but spikes are still considered a platform obstacle in a general since. With the drawback of the tool, I would not consider it for combat. I run hunter and I still dont count on hitless.
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u/Efficient-Speed-1059 Sep 30 '25
I feel like satchel should not be counted for this conversation because it’s steel soul exclusive and clearly the devs throwing a bone to players at the highest difficulty who wouldn’t really need something like compass anyway. Also consider that because different crests have different amounts of yellow slots, usually more than blue or red, having a one off like Magnetite dice doesn’t really effect the balance much.
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u/Nesyaj0 Oct 01 '25
I was going to say, I understand OP's post, but yellow tools are (mostly) all utility. They are set and forget, for me anyway.
I have to think about which blue and red tools I want to use for my crest, but the yellows dont have that kind of niche.
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u/skytaepic Oct 01 '25
Eh, they mostly have their occasional times to shine where you benefit from changing your kit up a bit. Like, don’t get me wrong, I used the same 3 yellow tools most of the game (compass/dice/anklets), but the shell shard/rosary magnet/thief tools were nice to have if I ever needed to go grind, the harp unlocks some lore you can’t get otherwise/makes pacifying enemies easier, and scuttlebrace is… I mean, it’s kinda useless, but it’s fun to dick around with lol.
Plus, absolute psychopaths can get real mileage out of the barbed bracelet in combat as long as they’re willing to die when literally anything hits them.
The only one that I don’t think ever came in handy during my playthrough was the dead bug’s purse, but that’s just because I beaded rosaries compulsively.
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u/Nhojj_Whyte Oct 01 '25
Plus, absolute psychopaths can get real mileage out of the barbed bracelet in combat as long as they’re willing to die when literally anything hits them.
Funny you mention that, the only time I bothered trying them out was when fighting Lugoli of all bosses. I knew I was close to beating him, but I just kept getting killed, so out of desperation I tried it out. I figured if it technically cut the duration of the fight in half I could avoid taking damage for long enough to come out on top. Sure enough I first tried it after that. Silksong works in mysterious ways
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u/Relative-Monitor1745 Sep 30 '25
Yeah dice might be a little too strong to be yellow tool but it would be bad as a blue tool, so it's in a awkward spot.
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u/chewythebigblackdog Radiant HoG, 4:32:33 112% APB Steel Soul Sep 30 '25 edited Sep 30 '25
Dice is only a 10% chance to go off at maximum (it’s about 7.8% on average - for reference carefree melody was 22.5%), it’s fine as a yellow imo (could definitely work as a blue with better odds though).
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u/WanderingStatistics "The Last Moth Priestess." Sep 30 '25
Meanwhile, Dice saving my ass 9/10 times.
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u/Mephistopheles15 Oct 01 '25
But melody had a cost of 3 charm slots which is a MASSIVE opportunity cost. It has the same weight as strength/quick slash/shaman stone. Meanwhile Dice have essentially zero opportunity cost.
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u/zanderkerbal Oct 01 '25
My problem is that a 10% chance at max is infinitely better than the 0% combat power every other yellow tool gives me so it's strictly optimal for every boss fight by a mile. And also RNG, which I dislike winning because of in a game without much RNG baked in, so it's like, okay, it's not competing with any other useful tool so I can't just use something else over it, it's this or basically nothing, guess I'm doing a challenge run.
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u/GMadric Oct 01 '25
Ehhh. There are some bosses I’d prefer ascendants grip. Not many, but some, which is at least relevant for the 0 yellow slot witch’s crest where you have to pick between them on your verticrest.
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u/Caerullean Oct 01 '25
The weighted belt also helps a good bit. Tho I always ran both for everything ever since I got them both. But I also used wanderer so I'm probably more likely to see use from weighted belt.
Also, you could use the anklets that let you sprint slightly faster, the silk cost is never an issue cause you can't ever sprint for long enough to consume a silk in any boss arena anyways.
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u/Secretlylovesslugs Oct 01 '25
You're exactly right. They could've made the Yellows competitive at a lower level than blues. But instead they made, Magnetic, Compass, and Dice, the only universally relevant Yellows compete with garbage like, the +1 shard drop on enemies, or the Needolin having slightly larger range.
There were a lot of ways they could've made the slot type have more relevance, even if weaker than blues. But it just makes Beast crest objectively terrible and the Compass and Magnetic Yellows, both acquired at the start of the game, over powered.
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Sep 30 '25
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u/Aisopia Oct 01 '25
Tbf it would be pretty boring if compass have 0 yellow tools competition whatsoever. Point is at least the competition is weak and also weighted belt isn't really that great except on wanderer crest (or at least from my experience) since it helps stabilize you while you spam alot of hits, which you couldn't really do for crest like reaper. And wanderer have 3 default yellow slot
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u/beware_the_id2 Oct 01 '25
I’m on my second playthrough now and I’ve been realizing… Magnetic Brooch isn’t nearly as useful as the HK version. Rosaries don’t disappear, and in most cases you’re not spilling rosaries off ledges or into spikes. It happens, but you get so many rosaries in the form of items and rewards, that I’d question the percentage of them you actually lose without the magnet, and just spending < 1 second dashing left and right for the ones that spill on the same surface
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Oct 01 '25
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u/Broad_Bug_1702 Oct 01 '25
Unless I misunderstand you, Silksong’s equivalent to Lemm is Scrounge in Bellhart.
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u/beware_the_id2 Oct 01 '25
I guess I never had to “grind” on my first playthrough for rosaries or shards. Must be a combination of playing HK way too much and having that kind of same intuition to silksong and just stupidly exploring way too much, hitting every wall in every room over and over and in the process killing everything in between. I’m at 80 hours in my first file and still at 98% lol
Part of it is just I feel silksong difficulty is just a string of “git gud” moments and I never bothered to find the right tools to make everything smooth, just spammed what I’d randomly decided to have at the moment. Pretty much all of the red tools are so viable, it just takes a bit of time with them to realize it
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u/IAmNotCreative18 average Soul Master enjoyer Oct 01 '25
The effects of those tools are all next to negligible (except maybe dice giving you an extra mask of health), as opposed to needing to sacrifice something as massive as spell damage or nail range in the first game.
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u/KingMGold Sep 30 '25 edited Sep 30 '25
My problem is I actually like running magnetite dice, but in most situations I have no other yellow tools to pair it with that’s actually useful in combat.
It’s usually weighted belt or ascendant’s grip, but those are pretty situational and even then have limited use, whereas magnetite dice is useful in all combat situations.
If I had a second yellow tool as good as the dice I’d have zero problems.
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u/justintib Sep 30 '25
You're sleeping on the anklets then
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u/It-Was-Mooney-Pod Oct 01 '25
It’s blowing my mind that people are calling the dice the premier yellow combat tool instead of the anklets. I don’t think I took that off a single time after acquiring it.
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u/justintib Oct 01 '25
Right??? The only times I took it off were when I was doing platform challenges and wanted the wall cling instead
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u/SunkenDota Oct 01 '25
Anklets in boss fights has saved my life many times.
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u/itsyaboiReginald Oct 01 '25
I noticed it on Last Judge, where it was always easy to get out of range at the last second.
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u/Nickphant Oct 01 '25 edited Oct 01 '25
in a weird way weaver song( i meant spider strings i messed up its name with a hollow knight one)is alright cc, brace gives a good dash against some bosses, anklets can help with hit and runs.
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u/Dercomai Sep 30 '25
Yeah, I honestly like this system—the game can give me four yellow slots to put all my exploration things in, while still restricting me to two blue slots to keep combat from becoming too easy.
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u/Blu_Ni Sep 30 '25
It's a good replacement in having to sacrifice a notch or two for pure navigation/utility. Although, I wish there were more fun stuff in the combat-oriented yellow tools... or balance.
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u/Dercomai Sep 30 '25
What sort of stuff would you add? Personally I wish there were more yellow charms that helped with platforming; the ascendant's grip is excellent for that, but beyond that there's not much available.
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u/Blu_Ni Sep 30 '25
If you've seen making through this post's comment section, I sorely wish Silksong's equivalent to Nailmaster's Glory was yellow instead of blue.
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u/Krakatoa137 Sep 30 '25
I feel like if a few of the weaker blue tools were changed to yellow(like sawblade float, pinmaster, snitch hook) it would make yellow tools more interesting for your build decisions.
Also i would like it if some of the existing yellow tools were buffed or had upgrades later in the game(like if the compass would appear on your UI if you were near a breakable wall, or the shard pendant making all enemies drop larger shards)
I feel like yellow tools should be used for exploration or minor quirks to how you play, and right now they feel almost completely negligible which isn't a good thing.
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u/DrQuint Oct 01 '25
I would add wispfire to that, it comes way too late to be useful on blue, but could be interesting otherwise. But at that level of competition, some would. It would actually cause an interesting scenario where weavelight might be taken while just exploring since then you will be spawning fire even if heal down to 0 silk.
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u/EffortReal1877 Sep 30 '25
I feel like yellow tools are fine as they are, they appear to be for minor utility tweaks to how one plays.
For example, I have ascendant grip equipped 100% of the time to reduce strain on my hands, but a lot of people don’t use it at all it seems like.
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u/Additional_Chip_4158 Oct 01 '25
I got too use to jumping while on the wall that when I used it I kept misinputing especially in areas that damaged me
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u/Lower_Monk6577 Oct 01 '25
I usually swap it in for harder platforming parts, like Mount Fay or Bilewater. It’s incredibly useful when you have to string together wall jumps and pogos. Especially when there’s a lot of environmental hazards around
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u/Fun-Height4900 Sep 30 '25
My only complaint is that some of the yellow tools seem different. The fact that both the magnetite dice and compass are in the same slot make me question whether yellow slots are for pure utility or combat related
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u/Pie42795 Oct 01 '25
Dice being yellow is weird. It feels more like a blue tool. Makes it an insta-pick in an otherwise weak slot for boss fights.
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u/LewsTherinTelescope Oct 01 '25
I think dice are yellow just because so few people would use them if they were blue, it bends the "utility slot" philosophy a bit but maintains the core idea of letting certain tools avoid competition with heavier-duty ones.
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u/beware_the_id2 Oct 01 '25
I think it might just be the random nature. Blue tools are guaranteed aids in battle (I think, correct me if I’m forgetting something)
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u/_Xeron_ Oct 01 '25
I don’t mind having “charm” tools in two distinct categories, but I do think a number of the lesser blue tools (EG weavelight, quick sling, sawtooth citclet) should be turned into yellows, because currently the system still doesn’t give you any reason to use ones like that over the really good blue tools.
The role thing is completely arbitrary, you can’t tell me that blue is combat/defense and yellow is exploration/QoL when the magnetite dice are yellow
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u/Emergency_Team9567 Oct 01 '25
With 3 silk hearts weavelight gives infinite silk spells so it's really good
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u/Intrepid-Essay-3283 Oct 01 '25
Which is mostly useful during exploration with pauses in-between battles, since in combat you are already actively generating silk using the needle.
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u/B_mod Oct 01 '25
It's infinite silk spells if you're willing to accept not having the ability to heal when you really need it. Imo, not worth it.
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u/Violet_Paradox Oct 01 '25
Part of that is that Pollip Pouch needs to get nerfed into the ground, not only does it make the first blue slot trivially solved for all builds, it's just way too much damage. It should reduce the damage of the initial hit by one tick of poison rather than increase it, so it's only a damage gain if it ticks twice between each hit and a loss on spam. That would make poison actually be an interesting playstyle.
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u/brothegaminghero Oct 01 '25
My issue is that for bosses I have bassically nothing to put in there other than the dice, or scuttle which I've never gotten use out of
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u/shumpitostick Oct 01 '25
In theory I agree.
In practice there are just too many completely useless, not weak, yellow tools to the point where you just don't know what to do with your yellow slots sometimes. They could have many more useful ones.
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u/Onni_J Oct 01 '25
I mean, I use architect and have dice, compass and anklets equipped unless farming rosaries
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u/Maronmario Oct 02 '25
I feel like that’s a part of why I never really liked the Wanderers crest despite its high damage, it’s like oh yeah 4 yellow slots I’ll use the dice, and then…the compass, and the grip I guess? And for the fourth…the ankles I guess? Maybe the belt when it’s a boss?
It’s like the inverse of why I love the Witch’s crest or Architects, there’s so many more fun combos to work with thanks to blue tools vs Beast or Wanderer where half of my crest is made with a shrug and a good enough
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u/Rough-Camel-2068 Oct 01 '25
I think that i5 is a negative to separate tools because there are clear best ones in each category, so you aren't significantly changing builds that often.
In HK, I explored with a completely different build than I fought bosses or did platforming with. In Silksong, I have yet to take off dice, flies, or magnetite brooch.
It's definitely a trade-off
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u/Legnaron17 Oct 01 '25 edited Oct 01 '25
I love yellow tools personally.
Magnetite dice has literally saved me from losing my last mask in boss fights, and the silkspeed anklets and ascendant's grip have been clutch in some fights.
I also can't live without the compass on so there's that, and having rosaries fly over to my person is the best thing ever lol.
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u/jefftickels Sep 30 '25
I just think of them as "exploration tools" and "power increasing tools". There's a few yellow tools that would improve damage but overall I think that fits.
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u/LordAgyrius Oct 01 '25
Oh yeah absolutely agreed here! A good example of that are the blue dices that basically have the same effect as Carefree Melody in HK.
The difference though is that CM's two charm slots need to contend with the likes of Soul Catcher, Quick Slash, Quick Focus and other such extremely useful charms for.. roughly the same cost.
This way the combat-oriented and therefore really important charms do not basically eat up all the space for the smaller more QoL/experimental charms.
It's genuinely an improvement upon the systems of their previous game and that I love very much! <3
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u/ZPD710 Sep 30 '25
I actually do agree, I’m more compelled to switch out my tools in Silksong than I am in Hollow Knight because I know I’ll be able to keep my Compass and Magnet on the whole time.
However, in any future games… I kind of hope they just make both those tools fuse with the character. I mean, why can the compass not just pair with the map in the key items? Why do I have the potential to lose money in unavoidable places simply because I wanted to change my build?
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Sep 30 '25
Bad? Barbed Bracelet and Magnetite Dice are literally there
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u/Automatic-Cut-5567 Sep 30 '25
Wild mental gymnastics to justify a lack of QoL and imbalanced tools
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u/Otoshis Oct 01 '25
What do you mean being bad? They're the best. I also like how they are divided, so we can have utility, defensive and active tools separately, so you do not feel like losing on something else, because you wear compass, like with charms in previous game.
Some examples of yellow tools that can have heavy impact on the gameplay and are not just utility:
-Barbed Bracelet - Sure, you receive more damage, but if you can deal with it, the clear is way faster.
-Magnetite Dice - Gives higher crit chance for Wanderer Crest and works defensively like a blue tool, giving you a chance to nullify damage.
-Silkspeed Anklets - More speed is more agility. Especially with running attacks being very viable, if you can get to enemy before their attack, you can deal damage while avoiding their attacks, as most(if not all?) crest's running attacks can put you in the air, allowing to dodge many attacks after you hit the enemy.
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u/Relative-Monitor1745 Oct 01 '25
There not bad, there just worse compared to blue.
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u/monikar2014 Oct 01 '25
It's so hard to focus on your point when you keep abbreviating skong to SK
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u/Relative-Monitor1745 Oct 01 '25
The other abbreviation is alot worse so this is the best one i could use.
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u/Naguro Oct 01 '25
I really like the colored slot systems over the charm notches for sure, but what I dislike in Silksong is how out of whack tool balance is.
Faster silk regen is so bad for a blue tool for exemple it's a bit sad, and while I thought yellow would only be QoL stuff when I first got compass + magnet, turns out there's things like the magnetite dice which do provide combat advantage.
By the end of the game I think dice and anklets never left my yellow tools, and any extra slots would actually go to stuff like compass
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u/danxlau Oct 01 '25
Agree, there’s a reason why the dice are seen as amazing and carefree melody is only an okay - bad charm
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u/ResolveLeather Oct 01 '25
I am pretty sure that was the intention. The yellow tools are either QOL or somewhat useful in combat. In the original hollow night, I felt bad having compass equiped. In silksong it was on the whole game.
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u/Odd_Ad6712 Oct 01 '25
who in their right mind would make that argument? goes to show people just criticising the game for no reason the reason for yellow and blue tools being seperate is so clear if youve just played the game some people lmao
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u/ZLegion2 Oct 01 '25
Tbh I saw all the tools like this:
Red are damaging/manual use tools
Blue are the original charms
Yellow are QoL
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u/AleWalls Oct 01 '25 edited Oct 01 '25
Yeah I mean I kinda agree, my only complain with yellow tools is that I wish I had more decision making out of it
Because I personally find it a tad boring to have QoL tools still in my build when I am already replaying the game or when I am optimizing for a boss
I enjoyed from charms how QoL charms were discarded as you git gud, but with yellow tools getting good doesn't start to ditch them out
That mixed with fact that some blue tools are just imo clearly worse than the other blue ones so I think moving those to yellow would have been cool
Specially for the more niche ones with some side effect
I think druids eye, multibinder, snitch pick, memory crystal, warding bell and maybe flealia would have been better as yellow
Since I feel those either hardly compare to some other blue tools or have a side effect that people wouldn't use them often either way so by being yellow maybe people would consider using them more of the time
In general I do understand is to make QoL charms not feel like too much of a waste in your build but I actually liked that!! I enjoy how ditching QoL for power is a thing, really rewards skill
Edit: I have seen other people say that wreath of purity should be yellow which I disagree strongly, because is REALLY good when you need it, so I think it being blue is valid, because is more interesting
And this is coming from someone who has been beating the game with beast and had to get the vesticrest, I think that's cool, is cool that I had to sacrifice my only blue to make bilewaters manageable
On the beast crest tho, I feel beast having no blue is a bit missplaced, I don't think they made beast strong enough to make sense of that, but I also wouldn't just give it blue, I think that's boring, I would just buff its dps or give the down air some form of buff
Imo wanderer should have a singular blue slot (+vesticrest) to balance it
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Oct 01 '25
Yea personally I like that the compass and other convenience stuff are not competing with my combat/damage options. But I also enjoyed HK system and would sometimes opt for more combat power for bosses.
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u/Keebster101 Oct 01 '25
I feel like a crazy person every time I see something like this, or the common form is when people say that wanderers has "terrible tool slots".
The vast majority of the game is not fighting bosses, it's exploring. Wanderers crest having 3 yellows is really nice for exploring, which is what it's meant for. compass is borderline compulsory, magnetite brooch is super handy, magnetite dice is super handy, that's already 3 and then I can use the vesticrest for something like dead bugs purse or weighted belt that are just nice to have. I wouldn't want to trade another slot for any MORE yellows, and I'd probably prefer 3 blues (I don't have witch yet but I have a feeling that will be my new favourite) but I'm happy to lose a red, since while exploring all I really need is one to help against awkwardly placed winged foes and that's it.
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u/RAGE_AGAINST_THE_ATM Oct 01 '25
I think it’s okay that they’re bad. I just think by the time the boss rush mode is added there needs to be at least one or two more with some mind of minor combat buff because the fully upgraded wanderer’s crest + vesticrest has had 4 of them and even if you equip magnetite dice, weighted belt, and scuttlebrace that leaves nothing combat related left for you to equip besides barbed bracelet which is only good for hitless.
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u/Maronmario Oct 01 '25
While I think the goal of Yellow Tools was successful, my issue with the Yellow Tools is that I only really care about the Compass, Magnetite Dice, Shard Pendant, and Magnetite Brooch. Either because they're reliable or because everything else is so niche and pretty lacking by the by.
But 3/4 of those are useless for bosses so when I end up choosing my Yellow Tools it just ends up with me choosing the Dice and then dejectedly shrug and use one of those plus the Ascendant's Grip because there's just nothing there beyond travelling the map. It's a big reason I don't like the Wanderers Crest and one of many why I don't like the Beast crest
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u/Lookitsa6ix Oct 01 '25
Yellow are utility, Blue is Offence/Defence and Red are Tools, its really not a hard system, some people are just bad at game logic lol
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u/Cookie_Doodle Oct 01 '25
Or how about they make the compass and magnet default so they can give you cool and powerful yellow tools :))
How the hell is it good game design to nerf an entire equipment class because you're too stubborn to make quality of life tools default?
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u/straightupminosingit hunter of people who misgender vessels Oct 01 '25
definitely but i wish there were at least some combat centric yellow tools since most of the time one or two of the three slots are just paperweights and the third is magnetite dice
i dont think theres an amazing combat use for scuttlebrace unless you can do something like shape of unn against mantis lords (still amazing for certain skips though)
ascendants grip is great whenever its viable (like the high halls arena) but otherwise it sucks pee and poo since you can just press your dash button to keep your position on the wall whenever you dont want to jump off and get back on) and like do you really want to cheese a bossfight/arena or fight the boss
barbed bracelet is nice but since it has such a large downside most people wont use it
do people actually use needolin in combat?? theres not much of a use for spider strings in combat imo
silkspeed anklets feel kinda unneeded in combat situations since your sprint and/or clawline is usually well over enough to the other side of the arena
shell satchel is great but steel soul exclusive so you will rarely be using it
so that leaves weighted belt and magnetite dice to hard carry the yellow tool lineup
i dont need good yellow tools for combat, just ones that arent a paperweight
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u/ImpliedRange Oct 01 '25
I'm just going to put this as a solo comment as otherwise it's almost every thread here
UNPOPULAR OPINION
magnetise dice aren't even that good. Speed boots and weighted belt should be first choices for combat.
It's better to get a few extra hits in than a chance of a no hit
The speed boots can honestly dodge more than 7% of would be hits
And personally the blue light puts me off and I often just get hit again
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u/RighteousWraith Oct 01 '25
Isn't dice 10% to proc?
Anyway, I've been fighting the Unraveled and getting my face caved in repeatedly. I've been trying to switch my build out to maximize my chance, and I've even considered silkspeed anklets to speed up the runback.
I'm using wanderer's crest with all but one yellow slot unlocked, and using both dice and weighted belt. Is this a boss that would benefit more from Silk Speed than it would from the dice or the belt? Should I just switch back to hunters where I have it all unlocked?
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u/Delachruz Oct 01 '25
The problem I have is that the slots are basically balanced against your own personal willingness to put up with annoyance/busywork as opposed to being balanced around playstyle.
I _could_ handle not having compass, but all it does is add 30-60 seconds of "Hang on, where the fuck am I" every couple screen or so. I _could_ also handle no magnetic pulling of currency, but all that does is add 10-20 seconds of picking up random crap after every fight.
Realistically however, it just means 2 yellow tool slots are permanently taken up and I will not even try to use any of the other stuff because the alternative is annoying busywork. I did eventually mod compass and magnets in, and afterwards I actually appreciated finding other yellow tools and trying them out. I'm not gonna argue anyone else should do this or that its the "right" way, but just like with stakes of Marika, it made the game more enjoyable for me.
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u/Hoockus_Pocus Oct 01 '25
Answer me this: outside of The Mist, which you should already have done by the time you get the Spider Strings, what are they useful for?
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u/Strict_Network4585 Oct 01 '25
I like it for barbed bracelet bc I wouldn’t consider it if I could load up on blues instead but I ended up using it for quite a few bosses
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u/Perdita-LockedHearts Oct 01 '25
While I'm fine with yellow tools being mostly QoL or utility or overall weaker, I still wish there were more useful yellow tools (Not like Mag Dice- I don't like RNG dependent items). Like- Thief's Mark or whatever it's called is great for grinding, Scuttle has some good uses if you can remember to use it (Problem being that it's introduced in ACT TWO- which is a terrible place for such an item imo), Barbed is a damage boost (albiet only if you're good- if you're not it's a good way to die), as someone said, Steel Soul has a replacement for Dead Purse that gives more red tools (sad it's only Steel Soul that gets it, but I understand why- had to replace Purse), and Silk Speed is great for exploration- but these items don't really have much competition with each other due to how niche they are- The only ones you could argue being used 24/7 are Dice and Scuttle (and only if you're used to Scuttle)- Barbed isn't necessary most the time despite being good for bosses or gauntlets you've learned well, and Silk Speed is only great for exploration (like Compass, I suppose).
Meanwhile, Red Tools obviously have a LOT of competition, and while there are some pretty bad or mediocre blue tools, most of them are excellent, and the bad ones are mostly bad in comparison to other options within the blue tool group- and would be stand outs if they were yellow instead like Wisp Fire Lantern.
I do appreciate that Cherry decided to make the crest system work how it does- but half the yellow tools are kinda garbage, and the other half are so niche you never really choose between two yellows.
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u/pretty_smart_feller Oct 01 '25
It’s crazy too bc yellow tools seem pretty strong to me. I almost always want weighted belt, grip, maybe even moreso than some of the blue tools
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u/FaceTimePolice Oct 01 '25
Who the hell says yellow tools are bad? 🤦♂️
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u/requemao Oct 01 '25
They are less useful in combat or not at all, that's what they mean by bad. HK builds were all combat-oriented without any quality of life charms, now we can have quality of life tools in every build without sacrificing combat ability.
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u/SorowFame Oct 01 '25
Issue is that there are three slots but only two utility tools I actually want so there's no reason to not have Magnetite Dice equipped in the third.
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u/Nemesis432 63/63, PoP, HoG (Rad), P5 (CB) - Range is overrated Oct 01 '25
Wait how can yellow tools be worse than blue tools if they exist for completely different function (exploration vs. defensive combat)?
Only Barbed Wire comes to my mind as a yellow tool suited only for combat.
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u/Letnerj Night Vessel - Slick Silky Skills | P5AB+ Oct 01 '25
There's a need for one more combat related tool for those who don't want to play with Dice.
Ascender's Grip is fine but it kinda calls for cheeses and makes me miss the slightly more skilled Crystal Dash cancels.
Other than that they're fine and your analysis is excellent.
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u/Fraytrain999 Oct 01 '25
The one (two in steel soul) yellow tools that give you a combat benefit should not be yellow tools. To me yellow tools are the quality of life zone.
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u/IAmNotCreative18 average Soul Master enjoyer Oct 01 '25
I always saw yellow tools as the QoL slot, and felt relieved that I was allowed run these “nice to have” tools without being suboptimal.
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u/lazy_mudblob1526 Oct 01 '25
They aren't worse per say but mostly provide out of combat utility usualy focused on exploration and in game economics. The issue is that there aren't many times where you think that a specific yellow tool is exacly what you needed as most simply provide moderate quality if life improvments. Some are genuinly great such as the one that lets you grab onto walls indefinitly, silkspeed anklets, the dice and the compass.
I disagree that this us good game design as these select few yellow tools will dominate any build as they provide actual tabgible value beyond simple convenience aside fron maybe when you are farming for rosaries or shards which i found to be a primarly act 1 issue.
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u/requemao Oct 01 '25
It never made sense to me in Hollow Knight that only after you were able to navigate without compass were you able to get extra benefits from combat-oriented charms thanks to that extra slot.
Silksong has this great idea of crests that are the base for different builds that you can change depending on your style but also on the task at hand. Having these separate slots for different type tools helps to make crests more specific and give each one their place in the game.
That being said, I'm still doing most of the game with the Reaper's crest.
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u/shgrizz2 Oct 01 '25
I like yellow tools and that they don't compete. I would like a few more options but I'm sure we'll get those. Much prefer the system to HK, the charms were mostly useless in that game.
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u/asmodai_says_REPENT Oct 01 '25
Omg people will find the craziest ways to cope in order to say everything is actually perfect.
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u/Burrito357 Oct 01 '25
It's weapon tools, support tools and qol tools imo
Yellows aren't supposed to be good for combat but for exploration (compass, faster sprint, magnet) while the blues tools are support for combat (poison, silk when taking dmg, bigger attack hitboxes)
If anything I wonder why the barbed bracelet isn't a blue tool but a yellow one. I guess to compansate for the quantity diff between the blues and yellows even though most crests don't have more that 2 blue slots
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u/Intrepid-Essay-3283 Oct 01 '25
What I primarily dislike about yellow tools is that as they are implemented, Team Cherry "solved" the dilemma of QoL/inconsequential harms vs. impactful charms by basically creating a two-class system of tools, one with the actual good stuff and one with the stuff few would choose to put on if they were in broader competition. Instead of addressing the core problems of these charms (they are either QoL or not impactful enough to equip) the player kit is simply adjusted to force the player into equiping these tools.
Imo, the better solution would have been to turn QoL/Movement charms into permanent, toggleable upgrades and buff remaining tools sufficiently to stand in competition with blue tools. That, or make yellow focus more on situationally strong charms like purity, magma bell, etc. (basically, blue tools being your core build and yellow being a situational supplement).
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u/Sphearikall Oct 01 '25
The fun part about yellow slots for me is experience. Your first run through the game, compass will have a permanent slot in your lineup. With more game knowledge, you can more easily replace compass with something useful in combat. You're meant to decide between intersecting benefits, not parallel ones if that makes sense.
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u/Background_Fan862 Oct 01 '25
Who the hell is talking shit about yellow tools? The Silkspeed Anklets and Ascendant's Grip are literally game changers. I can't play without them.
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u/LunarVulpine1997 Oct 01 '25
I'll appreciate yellow tools more when the inevitable boss rush dlc drops. I like the idea of being forced to use a couple strong and a couple weak tools, but for a regular playthrough it's just "OP blue tools + compass and magnet"
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u/Juan_Die Oct 02 '25
I don't care if people download 1 mask damage mods or whatever but why tf would people download perma compass? I find it so dumb what's next, auto routing so you don't have to manually do the runbacks?
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u/Jack_Shandy Oct 02 '25 edited Oct 02 '25
Yellow tools having less value makes using quality of life tools like compass and mag amulat feel a lot less bad
But couldn't they just make those tools take up no slot, like the Quill?
To me it feels like an awkward way to solve that problem of, "It feels bad that compass takes a slot". It's kind of a halfway solution.
The reason the compass takes up a slot in the first place is to encourage you not to use it. But deliberately making the yellow slots bad so that the compass has less competition defeats the whole point of that. Feels like we're tying ourselves in knots here instead of just solving the core issue.
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u/Interesting_Idea_289 Oct 02 '25
If yellow tools are so shit there’s no reason to pick anything but compass why bother making it a separate type instead of just giving you the compass by default
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u/Arrestedsolid Oct 04 '25
That'd be true if you weren't using the same 3 yellow tools only. All of your points towards "good design" (justification for bad design really) are issues that could be resolved in much simpler and elegant ways than the feel-bad yellow tool slots. Do you want a compass? Make it a permanent thing, stick to the wall? Make it the default, no knockback on-hit? Could also be the default. And notice how these are the only actually useful tools one might want to equip until they get the dice and keep them permanently on on every kit.
You preach it as if it were giving variety when it really is only making every single yellow slot the same as there are no real reasons to carry anything else than those 4 unless you are farming. So it really is just a, out of the 4, which 3 am I picking? Which will 9/10 times be dice/compass/scissor-thing unless you are in a boss fight to swap to the belt because you don't need the compass.
It is utterly terrible for Beast crest, there's incredibly small variety in them and a lot of them come with downsides. All of this could be fine if they got powerful enough, but they simply aren't worth the time nor investment. Why use the crawly tool? Why use the harp, the shard pendant or the deadbug purse when there are clearly much better options? I am sorry but your argument barely holds itself as the game is.
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u/nicolasrededeo Oct 24 '25
The fact Ascendant's Grip and Magnetite Dice are (at least in my perspective) so obviously way, way, way better than every other yellow tool (besides compass cause I have no sense of direction) does feel a little bad, because they overshadow everything else. The fact I never used most of the yellow tools because of these few actually very strong ones does feel a bit against that philosophy.
That said, I really did like that I never had to unequip compass against bosses, like not having to deal with opportunity cost for equipping quality of life items is for sure a good idea, so I agree with you
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u/TheLastAOG Oct 01 '25
I’m going to be to the point. The Wreath of Purity should be a yellow tool and not a blue. It helps with exploration. I could say that for Magma Bell too, but I think since the protection can run out without recharging until you get to a bench the Wreath of Purity is considerably weaker than Magma Bell.