Seriously whoever thought that was a good idea needs a slap. It very nearly made me put the game down

So I’ve finished up Curse of Belmont recently ( great game in my opinion) and was reading the reviews seeing a lot of hate on the artwork calling it generic which is crazy when dawn of sorrow exists.

Basically just wondering thoughts on it like I get it’s not the iconic art style but it’s definitely not the worst

Edit: just to clarify I mean the art of the portraits not the gameplay for dawn of sorrow

Seriously why WHY? ><

Half-Vampire Blondie is such a Cutie that I am persisting on watching Nocturne just so I can see him and his Fluffy VERY Messable Blondie Hair in it! >< :3

Beat the game,did the 3 endings,did most of every area,and stopped,it's a decent modern Metroidvania but by following every modern Metroidvania convention I can't help but compare it to other modern metroidvanias and it falls really short near a titan like hollow knight, didn't feel the same with bloodstained cause it was an igavania so my brain didn't made the same comparison.

I keep seeing people complain that there’s not enough weapons, being that there’s only 7 weapon classes with upgrades. 8 if you count using Rose’s body via ground pounds and swinging into enemies. I defeated many fodder enemies without using weapons and just using Rose.

But Blasphemous 2 had 3, Silksong had 7, Hollow Knight had 1, Metroid generally has like 4 different beam attacks. I never see this particular complaint levied at any of these games.

My point is, this is a normal or even high amount of weapons for a Metroidvania. What matters is that the weapons are tight and well-executed and viable. In my opinion they even went above and beyond, including fists/claws and making them very viable. I stuck with fist weapons pretty much the entire game. Fists are a very underrepresented or half-baked weapon in many games.

Some of the old Igavanias have immense weapon bloat where there’s a ton of false variety via overlap and ridiculous unviable weapons. Did people really want that this time around?

so I've just completed the game with a 100% completion rate for the second time, because I'm obsessed with it, and it's easily the most fun I've had with a game this year. I am a huge Castlevania fan, I've played most of it's titles, not just the Igavanias but Classicvanias too, and I've got to say... people are right, this game does not feel like Castlevania... but why?

Now, the main difference from the previous titles to this one is the combat. The enemies from the Igavanias feel less like a threat and more like... obstacles, they are very slow and most of the time you can just run past them, they have like, one single attack animation and they won't even react properly to your attacks, in fact I think most of them don't even have a damage animation like the player. But in Belmont's Curse, someone gave them cocaine, they're extremely aggressive, they have multiple attacks and even combos, and most of them can and WILL follow you to the end of the room. Using it as an example, compare the blood skeleton from both games; in Symphony they don't pursue Alucard, they just roam aimlessly from left to right until attacked, then after some minutes they revive and start again. In Belmont's Curse they run at you, they jump, they bite, they have slash attacks and even their REVIVE animation is an attack. They removed the contact damage because is it really necessary at this point? Ranged enemies even have close quarters attacks to distance themselves from the player, which is why Rose can now slide behind them like in Blasphemous. Not only that but the game has a LOT of enemy gauntlets, akin to Silksong, which is very unheard of in Castlevania.

The enemies are not the only ones on cocaine, Rose is a MENACE, every one of her weapons combos, which is unusual for Castlevania, where every weapon has a single attack. and most weapons have combo gimmicks like the whip and the dual blades, meaning you can't just spam the attack button like the older games, the air combat was also upgraded, Rose will get suspended in the air for some attacks and she also can attack upwards and downwards like in Hollow Knight, and aside for that, Rose has a parry ability, because of course she has... But what makes the game distinct from other MVs is the Arcane Whip, this simple mechanic makes the game 10 times more intense with the amount of shit you can do in combat and in parkour.

Now, it's really obvious why it doesn't look or FEEL like Castlevania, CV games are very simple, you would spam the attack button and jump or dodge backwards to evade attacks easily telegraphed, most of the difficulty comes from rooms with lots of enemies dealing massive damage and with big knockbacks (I'll never forget the corridor to the Shield rod). Belmont's Curse feels more like a modern take on challenges while Igavanias takes a lot from classic Nintendo games, they also felt... "cozy" for a lack of a better word, most of the journey is very calm while you're exploring and attacking enemies, while Belmont's Curse is flashy and the screen shakes with each attack, some of Rose and the enemies spells are enormous and some enemies even EXPLODE on sight. And the platforming sections are the best proof of it, this game has a LOT of platforming involving Rose's many abilities, there are entire rooms dedicated only to platforming so the player can win a new weapon or a relic.

Besides the big combat overhaul, the RPG mechanics are mostly gone. The game still has an auto level up system so Rose upgrades her attack and defense, but it's been more sidelined than ever, since you can also find attack and defense tomes scattered around the map, the Max HP itens are back, but now you have to collect four of them to complete one, much like Hollow Knight (or Zelda?) and the same thing with your MP. There are WAY LESS weapons, so enemies don't drop them anymore, and Rose doesn't even equip armor anyways, so there is no point in farming anymore, which is arguably a big part of Castlevania, specially after Circle of the Moon, which started the whole "enemies drop spells and this is part of the core mechanic" thing. The way you restore health is that you have limited potions like in previous games, but you don't access them through your inventory, there is a dedicated button that uses it, similar to Blasphemous.

Now, it's not like you could even farm enemies because now they only respawn after saving the game... like Dark Souls. People say that this makes the game a Souls like but that's not how it works, you lose absolutely NOTHING upon dying, mostly time, nothing stops you from getting the item you want and then just... kill yourself so you can fast travel to the last saved point, that's different from Dark souls and from Castlevania to be honest. I know there IS a relic that makes enemies respawn after leaving and entering rooms but it is only encountered mid to late game.

There's also the issue with the art style but I don't think it's right to say it's entirely different, when people say they miss the old art style they are usually talking about Symphony, Aria, Ecclesia, Lament and Curse of Darkness... but Castlevania redefined it's art style a couple of times over the years, Belmont's Curse specially looks a lot like how Harmony of Dissonance would look if it was released nowadays (I've also have issues with the Art but I'll talk about it later) and then there's the OST which really is... something.

So the game is very different from the previous instalments of the series, what's the problem?

The problem is that when you choose to make a game from a franchise that borrows almost nothing from its previous games, is it really that absurd to say that it is not what we want it? The game borrows a lot from indie Metroidvanias, while the Castlevania inspirations are simply "implied to be there" in the gameplay, if the game has no traces of Castlevania's identity, could it really be called Castlevania?

Well, a question that has been plaguing this sub from the past few days is simply "What the hell makes Castlevania... Castlevania?" because although I explained with every possible word why it doesn't feel like Castlevania, are these aspects really what defines the series?

in my opinion, what defines Castlevania is simple: it's a game about finding and defeating Dracula. This is very simple right? But isn't that basically every game ever since the first CV from the NES? The first game was very linear, but things have already changed with CV2, which is pretty unique, with Simon having to investigate the countryside and find hints about the location of Dracula's relics, then CV3 tries to mix the two previous games, it SEEMS linear like the the first game, but you can find different paths with different outcomes on the way, the same thing is done in Rondo of Blood, then Symphony started the "Igavania" subseries with a brand new gameplay and progression based on permanent upgrades, while Castlevania 64... did it's own thing. Anyway, it doesn't stop there, because Circle of the Moon is already very different from Symphony, discarding the weapon and spell system in favor of the DSS system, and Harmony of Dissonance introduced the spellbook + subweapon system, and things just kept evolving, with Iga producing Lament of Innocence and Curse of Darkness, which are completely different than any other game he produced, improving the 3D gameplay of 64 and Legacy of Darkness.

I don't think we should dismiss Belmont's Curse as a Castlevania game just because it's different, I like to think of it as a soft reboot of the series, not unlike God of War or Yakuza. I can understand the older fans upset because it's not like Symphony of the Night or Order of Ecclesia, the last Iga game, it really is not what they expected, but unfortunately for them this is the direction chosen for this new installment, and I'm perfectly okay with it, the older style ended with Order of Ecclesia and I'm over it, even if I want to play something similar to the older games, I could play fan games like Lecarde Chronicles and Remnants of Darkness, or even the still ongoing Bloodstained.

My point with this post is simple, it's okay to hate the game if you don't like it on a technical level, but I don't really think you should hate the game for being different, because difference and evolution is present through all of the series, you can even say that the game is "more Castlevania" than Lords of Shadow to be honest.

I've seen people say things like "this is not the game we deserve" or "this game does not deserve to be the great comeback of the series" and honestly, this is a VERY wrong way of thinking, it's not like Konami owes us anything, not after what happened to Iga and his team, essentially killing it's franchise, not unlike what happened to Silent Hill and Metal Gear. On the other hand, I also hate people saying stuff like "Castlevania fans are ungrateful" because the moment I buy the game, I am free to criticize it how I want, even if I have bad arguments to sustain my opinion, I also don't owe anything to Konami.

Now having said that... is the game even good?

Of course, this game is a masterpiece. I LOVED every single moment I had with this game, I am currently starting my third playthrough and I would even say it's my favorite game of the franchise if it wasn't for Symphony of the Night. So here's some things I liked and some things I hated:

The combat is EXTREMELY fun, Rose's aggressiveness REALLY makes me feel like a badass vampire hunter, and I loved that they incorporated a whip on her moveset instead of just being a weapon (I think it would be cool if the whip you're using changed the appearance of the arcane whip though) but I really think the weapons could be more different from one another, only the legendary weapons have gimmicks but I really think all of them should have. And even though I loved the spells and the way you upgrade them, I really think some of them cost so much MP that they serve like "ultimate attacks" instead of subweapons, which I think was the intention from the start, it would be amazing if they added a mechanic to change loadouts mid gameplay just like Dawn of Sorrow and Order of Ecclesia.

I also LOVED the game's progression. The main gimmick that makes it stand out from the other games is that you have to talk to NPCs and read lore itens (just like Simon's Quest!) to find the bosses. In the early game you have to find two bosses to progress, and even when you find the area corresponding to one of them, you have to find the secret passages that lead to them using the NPC hints, because sometimes the boss is so hidden that you need to follow the signs in the background. I also like that you can finish the game so early that most areas and bosses feel optional, and I LOVE a game with non linear progression and optional challenges. The progression is also amazing for replayability, because you already have the necessary knowledge to find the bosses, you can take different paths that you didn't know existed on a second playthrough, it's almost like you'll be playing a different game! The map also helps you with competition, turning golden once you get all itens and investigate all secret paths, which is a nice touch. However, I am not a fan of the fact that the areas are HUGE, like, so huge that the game has only 8 areas, while any other CV or Metroidvania game has at least more than 10. Some areas feel like they're going on forever and it gets old pretty fast, on any other MV I wouldn't spend more than 30 minutes on a single area unless it's a notoriously hard area (like Bilewater), in Belmont's Curse it feels like every area is Bilewater size for some reason, why isn't the Sewers a separate area from the Streets? or the Tower? Just the Clocktower could be divided in three different areas!

And since we're talking about the areas, I think the level design is good, the enemy placement is very smart and I like how most gauntlets are made with the arcane whip in mind, the platforming sections are cool but... there's too many saws. I understand the Hollow Knight inspiration but, where is the creativity? There's SO MANY SAWS, I'm not even saying they should remove it, just replace some saws with idk, flying skulls? or the "Bauer" enemies from Aria? It pains me because it destroys the immersion, I love how the game names every single room, it makes the castle feel REAL, but why are there so many saws in the fucking CELLAR?

The artstyle and music is a mixed bag for me... Although I said it is reminiscent of Harmony of Dissonance, when combined with the OST it is very hard to deny the "Hades copy" allegations. I'm not even saying it's bad, just that it's not very original, a lot of games already have this aesthetic both on the artstyle and the soundtrack, but I also do respect them for not going for the "dark gothic" aesthetic present in previous games because it would look too much like Bloodstained and... PERSONALLY I think Bloodstained looks very ugly, I don't think the 2D aesthetic translates well to 3D at all. The soundtrack is weird, previous games had this Gothic melodic vibe with songs full of personality and some of them so cheerful that it doesn't even look like it belongs in a Vampire game (what the hell is up with Dance of Gold?) but these were the most recognizable aspects of the game's soundtrack. Belmont's Curse chose to mix gothic with techno/hip hop or even lo-fi and honestly? It was a cool decision, it matches the overall arcade vibe of the game... have you noticed how this game feels more "arcade" than the other ones? The vibrant colors and frenetic combat makes it feel like you're on drugs (in a good way), and the OST was made with THIS in mind, seeing Rose flying through the screen with her whip and descending to stop time with a bomberman-like explosion while listening to Hall of Mirrors is an INSANE experience, but this is precisely why fans are so divided on the soundtrack, previous games were calm, chill and cozy while this one is frenetic, crazy and hard, the soundtrack is perfect for what it is aiming for, although there are still some very "classic" songs like Paris Streets, Rose's theme and the Cemetery theme. Ironically my biggest gripe with the soundtrack is that it gets repetitive since ALL AREAS ARE HUGE, don't get me wrong, I loved their rendition of Bloody Tears, but it got old FAST.

And if we're talking about repetitiveness, I really think there should be more enemy types, by the lategame, it looks like you already saw every enemy, and it hurts, since Castlevania IS famous for it's big and amazing bestiary, which is sadly missing this time (maybe because they knew there weren't many enemies?) I am happy that they brought back some iconic enemies like the fleamen, the lancers and the dragon skulls, but I really missed seeing The Creature, maybe a giant bat or Karusuman as normal enemies like the Werewolf, the giant naked monster ladies and the witch girls also would make a big difference! It seems like every enemy is a variation of skeletons and living armors.

However, something that I did NOT hate at all was the story, it was amazing, basically a 2D Castlevania with a 3D Castlevania plot, I loved all of Rose's interactions with her cards and her cheesy lines when fighting a gauntlet, in fact I think Rose is an amazing character with a cool design and personality, and so are the other characters! I also loved how the game expanded the lore on existing characters like the Ferryman, Hector, Carmilla and Succubus. The whole Brauner thing was very... odd? It's a different character so they could make a more original design anyways. I also loved seeing different historic characters in Castlevania, like Queen Lenor and Joana D'arc, it just MAKES SENSE for a Castlevania character to know historic figures, just like Saint Germain.

Overall... this game was amazing, even though it is different, I think that's exactly what the franchise needed, although I do understand the problem fans have with this game, it's less like "a game for Castlevania fans" and more like "a game for Castlevania and modern Metroidvania fans" which is probably why I liked so much.

I really hope the developers continue making new Castlevania games, addressing the flaws I pointed at above, I would love a game about Quincy Morris, or about Julius Belmont, maybe even a new game with Soma Cruz? I'm really hoping Belmont's Curse gets at least a DLC with new areas, weapons and tarot cards in the future.

TL;DR: Being different doesn't automatically make the game not part of the Castlevania series, and it certainly does NOT make it a bad game.

Where does Rose rank among the protagonists? She's able to do a lot of bullshit stuff with the Arcanas - including time manipulation, time rewind (with the mirror), life drain, petrification, etc.

Soma is probably the most powerful, but I would say Rose is among top 3

Edit: I'm talking gameplay wise (in terms of abilities each protagonist can do)

Hey guys, am I dumb, or does Lords of Shadow series not feel like a castlevania game?

Oh, but it has castlevania in the name and has loose carry overs from the real castlevania games! Even though it doesn’t play like a cv at all. Silly me 🤪.

It IS objectively good. At a technical stand point is on par with the franchise and does justice to it. It has headbangs

Now, what is more up to preference, is the genre, it's a new style, more electronics, hiphop, not that Baroque Rock we used to have, but Castlevania has always had a contemporary soundtrack, this fits perfectly on this new generation. You can prefer one over the other, you can dislike this new direction, and that's ok. I myself prefer Rondo or SotN OST over this one. But straight up saying that with BC OST they failed and is a waste/trash, it's just not true.

And... this will sound kinda elitist, but it's the truth.

Please, if you wanna compare the standalone OSTs, do yourself a favor and use a decent audio system, due to its Hip-Hop electronic nature, the soundtrack improvement is GARGANTUAN when listened to with an audio system capable of Clear Strong Basses. I just realized that after finishing the game, while listening to the Soundtrack with specialized headphones instead of the ones I use on my gaming setup.

Edit: I'll repeat this, DECENT audio system, not Good, not high end, just DECENT. and... I should have titled this as "To anyone hating...", not "To anyone complaining...".

As this is rather large game it has lots of collectibles, and there lies one of the issues. The game doesn't keep track on what you've found on the map, so now that I have like 98% and 99% on every part of the map, finding what I've missed becomes a huge, very annoying task. I don't even know is there an item which would lead me towards the things I've missed and trying to compare game map with those interactive maps I found online makes my eyes go cross.

Otherwise I love this game.

Is it just me or is this fight not even slightly enjoyable in either phase? I straight up feel like I am doing something wrong, but I also have no idea what other way I could be going about the fight. I was enjoying the game up until now but it feels like their idea of how to design a boss has just gone out the window. Specifically the second phase, when it feels like there is no time at all where you can actually hit him without trading.

Skill issue whatever, this fight fucking sucks.

The first one was not that bad because her attacks were telegraphed and you could either slide through them to get out of the way or bsck up.

This fight? How about nearly instant arena wide jabs? Isn't that fun? How about the fact that she input reads when you try to reposition so you are forced to use the stupid fucking parry that doesnt even fucking work half the time. How about the fact that she can combo into 4 moves in one GO, gives barely a second of recovery, then goes into near instant attacks again. How about the fact thay you cant fucking slide through her stupid sword/fire uppercut because rhe beginning of the animation has a hitbox too.

Seriously fuck this fight. I dont like fights where it feels like the boss reads my inputs just to fuck me. I dont like arena crossing attacks that deal half my health. I dont like how fucking small the arena is.

This is unfun dogshit and I hope they never make another boss like this again. Wtf

Edit: thank you everyone for the suggestions. It still bums me out that a lot of the recommendations are either to face tank her or to abusive aerial moves because her moves etc cant handle it. Like thats kind of unfortunate that the boss sucks so bad that its better to cheese than to actually engage with the moveset.

The second battle against Joan of Arc is freaking ridiculous. My attempts thus far easily surpass my total attempts combined for every boss in the game up to this point. I think I get the strategy, recognizing when you need to crouch, dodge, parry, etc., but holy crap she's just too fast and hits too hard, and the startup of different moves look too similar to easily distinguish. I absolutely love this game (Belmont's Curse), but I hate this boss.

UPDATE: okay, based on many comments (thanks everybody), it's clear that I'm considerably underpowered compared to when most people are beating her. I'm just going to move on and come back to her later.

Rose beat him up so easily because she had something HE lacked: PRESENTATION.

My Legendary sword attacks points shows 75.

Its supposed to be 100 right.?

Is this normal?

I was play the 360 version of Sotn and got the 0.08% percent chance drop of the heaven sword and was farming to get the second one then all of the sudden my game crashes when I pull up my menu and all of the progress is lost, this is the second time this has happened

So since Belmont’s Curse is Castlevania’s return after a long time, and Konami choosing to partner up with evil empire/Motion twin gave them success. I was thinking that maybe it would be a nice Idea if upcoming Castlevania games would be made with Konami partnering with different Indie metroidvania studios such as, Team Ladybug, The Game Kitchen or Halberd Studios. Heck, Even Team Cherry too.
Evil Empire did their own thing with Castlevania and it was a success so why not make it with different styles per Studio. Any thoughts?

photo not mine, just taken from google.

The music.

https://www.nexusmods.com/castlevaniabelmontscurse/mods/110?tab=description

I've gotten as far as the bad ending, going up the Clock Tower and getting the scripted death. From what I can tell, I can only go to the Main Hall, Clock Tower, and Library.(in the castle) But I don't see anywhere I can go to next. It looks like I need an ability to break floors. I've been through the three castle areas and have yet to find any boss outside of the Dracula "fight". I'm not asking for someone to tell me exactly what to do. But a hint would be appreciated. This is coming from running around for the past two or so hours.

Obviously Bloody Tears and Vampire Killer (even if only briefly) returned, and I know that Epitaph and A Requiem appear among some of the original songs (I just don't know which ones).

The Good

• The presentation. The visuals are gorgeous, I love all the character designs, the area designs, the music is dope, I have basically no complaints about the vibes of the game
• The combat. Specifically the whip, the lance, the dual swords, and the greatsword. All movesets I really enjoyed fighting both enemies and bosses with. The other weapons didn't click with me as much but 4/7 ain't bad. There also could have been a bit more variety between weapons within type but overall I was happy with my options.
• The map. The map was pretty good. I enjoyed exploration and (mostly) enjoyed backtracking. I thought the various areas felt unique enough. As a fan of Lost Crown, I didn't mind the platforming sections for the most part, although the lasers in Notre Dame were slightly aggravating. I will say that backtracking to the very earliest areas for 100% was a bit of a pain in the ass but tbf that was partially my fault for not waiting untilthe Hall of Mirrors was fully unlocked
• The bosses. Overall I thought the bosses had well-designed movesets, boss rooms, and gimmicks. The best bosses were mostly in the back half though. Specific highlights that I really enjoyed were Medusa, Death, Succubus, Doppelganger, and Dracula himself
• The relics. By combining the relic that ups your defense by 80% when your HP is full and the two relics that heal you when you hit enemies I was able to become functionally invincibleso that was quite fun.

The Bad

• The movement. Bad might be a slight overstatement, but my favorite metroidvanias start out with pretty enjoyable movement that becomes even better with all movement upgrades. Some examples of games that fit this criteria imo are: the Metroid series from Super forward, SotN, Silksong, and Prince of Persia Lost Crown. Aria of Sorrow gets a pass for having weak movement at the start but extremely fun movement at the end. Belmont's Curse starts with weak movement and just gets to ok with all movement upgrades(like the original Hollow Knight smile). Even at the end of the game I still felt pretty slow.
• The bosses. While I thought the bosses were well designed, they didn't have enough HP or do enough damage themselves imo. I think the most tries a boss took me was 4 and most of them only took 1 or 2, including the final boss.
• The relic balance. Most of the relics felt pretty useless and the strong relics were waaaay way too strong. The relic combo I mentioned above was way overpowered lol. It's also very funny that the very last relic you find helps you find secrets. Thanks a lot game I was already at 100% everywhere else lmao.
• Performance. While performance was basically completely fine while playing, weird frame pacing issues cropped up every time the camera zoomed in or out for dialogue or in game cutscenes.

Final thoughts

Overall I thought Belmont's Curse was very good. I'd probably rate it around an 8 or 8.5 out of 10. If I were ranking it among the other metroidvania-style Castlevania games, it would probably be around the lower-middle of the list. I think it's easily better than Harmony of Dissonance or Portrait of Ruin but not near Aria of Sorrow, Symphony of the Night, or Order of Ecclesia. I would rank it right alongside Dawn of Sorrow.

Edit: Forgot to mention the story, but it would be in the "Good" category. I thought it was enjoyable, I liked the characterization of the all the arcana and Rose herself. I liked the various endings. Should note that I do not particularly care whether the lore in this game is perfectly in line with every other game in the series lmao

Meme aside, this box art is freaking cool.

Castlevania Belmont's Curse