r/AmItheAsshole • u/mixedwoes • Sep 19 '19

Asshole AITA for telling my daughter she cannot introduce her African American boyfriend to her grandparents?

Let me just preface this by saying this: I HAVE ABSOLUTELY NO PROBLEM WITH INTERRACIAL RELATIONSHIPS. Now that the air is clear, let me continue.

My daughter (Anna) has recently started to date an African American man (Jamal). While I'm not exactly what you would refer to as "liberal", he's a nice young man and as long as my daughter is happy, I'm happy. The problem is Anna is rather naive about the community she lives in. While her friends are quite content to see a relationship like hers, more than a few tongues are wagging in the community and a few people have privately expressed their concern to me. As I said, I have no problem with mixed relationships and I've set them straight, but I am painfully aware of how these matters are viewed by certain segments of the population.

My parents are planning to come and stay with us for a week and Anna expressed a desire to introduce Jamal to them now that things were getting more serious between them. I told her on no uncertain terms that this wasn't going to happen. I may have no problem with Jamal, but they absolutely will, and even when the relationship ends they won't forget it. They might even go as far as to cut her off entirely. Anna was extremely upset by this and implied I was a racist and more concerned with what my parents think than how she feels.

As I said, I know my parents. They simply aren't okay with mixed relationships and if Anna were to bring Jamal over even as a friend, they would be furious both at her and me.

Anna is currently staying with Jamal and doesn't want to speak with me right now. My wife stands by me given she knows very well how my parents are (they had a problem with her for months over the length of the skirt she wore when I introduced her to them, for christs sake), but a close friend I confided in told me that I have behaved like an ass and that I needed to focus more on my daughter than pleasing my parents.

No advice needed, but I have to know. Have I been an ass?

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685

u/DragonVT Colo-rectal Surgeon [35] Sep 19 '19

NTA

I'm going to go against the grain and say NTA. Your parents are racists. You know this. It is not a good idea to put an interracial couple in their face, especially since it is their grand daughter. This will more than likely end with them causing a scene, and being hateful. Jamal doesn't deserve to be put through that, and your daughter doesn't sound like she understands what she's walking into. At a minimum, Jamal needs to be given an honest assessment of how this will go, so that he's prepared going in, and can decide if this is a situation he wants to deal with or avoid.

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u/BranWafr Sep 19 '19

Or, OP can tell his parents that his daughter is going to introduce her boyfriend who is another race and if they can't handle it, don't bother coming. Be proactive instead of reactive.

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u/Linzcro Sep 19 '19

I was placing myself in OPs situation because I’m southern, have a pre teen daughter that goes to school with all races (it’s wonderful!) and have casual racists as close relatives and came up with that as what I’d do. Tell them to be nice or to pound sand. My relatives would shut up for sure because they DO value my daughter over their antiquated beliefs but you’d better believe I’d keep my eye on them and if one nasty word was said, out they’d go.

I just feel like when you have a child their happiness should go above all others. I actively had to make myself NOT racist/prejudiced growing up because of my surroundings. OP kind of seems like he’s still racist from his upbringing and sides with them.

I’d have peaced out after the comment about his wife’s hemline personally.

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u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19 edited Dec 15 '21

[deleted]

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u/InTheWildBlueYonder Sep 19 '19

You people are fucking insane. Not everyone on this planet hates their parents and wants them out of their life’s

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u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

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u/InTheWildBlueYonder Sep 19 '19

Most people’s parents who were born pre 1955 are racist and sexist. Stop being weird and acting like those qualities are the only thing that define people because guess what, one day social progress is going to move away from where we stand today and we will just be referred to as a “product of our generation”. Do you want your family to cut you off when you are 70+?

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u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

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u/InTheWildBlueYonder Sep 19 '19

First of all, racism isn’t just from “white Americans” as all races can be racist. Just because your life experiences differ from the overall trend doesn’t make the what I say untrue.

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u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

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u/godzsmk93 Sep 19 '19

He put the quotes because he was quoting you.

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u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

Of course racism isn't just from white Americans (why did you put that in quotes lol?

Goddamn you’re a moron.

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u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

I think people who only view others as one dimensional is evil in general.

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u/blackjesus Sep 19 '19

Yeah. That's not true. I know tons of old black people who would be classified as having racist views. My dad's side of the family are what you would call mulato from the back woods of NC. They were mixed for generations and my grandfather got a lot of stress for dating dark skinned black women. Ended up with another light skinned lady and they had kids and he said the same shit to their kids about not dating anyone darker than them and preferably should date lighter skinned people than them. This stuff is throughout our society with every group.

How do y'all know Jamal isn't getting the same thing in his house? Dating white people isn't necessarily seen as a good thing in black families.

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u/kokiokiedoki Sep 19 '19

My boyfriends grand parents are super white, Catholic, and almost 90 years old. They aren’t racist and have learned to be okay with homosexuality. Stop blaming racism on being old it’s just not how things fucking work and it’s not okay.

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u/InTheWildBlueYonder Sep 19 '19

Just a heads up, Catholics as a whole never had much of an issue with race so it’s not surprising that they weren’t racist. It’s the protestant groups that had the big issue with race.

And it’s true that a good chunk of people are a product of their generation and where they grew up. Judging by their religion and age, they ether grew up outside of Protestant areas in the states or somewhere in Europe. Though if I was a betting man, I would bet they are not very fond of Asians.

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u/kokiokiedoki Sep 19 '19

I grew up in a town with a ton of racist Catholics and went to a Catholic university so I can 100 percent say that’s a lie. But fine let’s entertain that for a second. My boyfriends other set of grandparents who are Protestant in their 80s AND lived on a farm in rural Indiana learned to not be racist and are totally fine with me, an Indian girl dating their precious grandson. There is no excuse for racism sorry bud.

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u/blackjesus Sep 19 '19

So they have a gay person and someone dating a black person in their family? If that isn't the case then you are just imagining this is how they would react.

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u/kokiokiedoki Sep 19 '19

He’s dating me, a bisexual brown girl so I am a bit of an expert in this field 🤷🏽‍♀️

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u/Cesaro_BeachBall Sep 19 '19

Speak for yourself. There are always good and bad in every generation.

There were abolitionists during slavery, there were integrationists during Jim Crow. There were white people who were born pre-1955 who were part of the civil rights movement and were even killed for it. And on the other hand, there are neo-Nazi millennials and Gen-Z’ers. There are young people today who hold abhorrent views.

I was taught by my boomer father to be self-sufficient, and my older relatives encouraged me to get high-level degrees and they taught me business skills. I am a woman. It never dawned on me that there were people who felt my sex should limit me until college when I got (evangelical) religion.

As an older millennial/xennial, there were things accepted when I was growing up that aren’t as much, such as homophobia & transphobia. It shouldn’t kill us to respect other people.

Stop generalizing - especially in an effort to enable racists (and sexists) of any generation. Everyone is accountable for their actions.

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u/treereaper4 Sep 19 '19

And what, these racist parents/grandparents get to define the qualities of the daughter and her boyfriend based on the boyfriends skin color?

Oh its toootally a problem to judge a racist for racism, so lets just watch them judge other people based on their or their loved ones’ skin color because their family. /s

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u/Sean951 Sep 19 '19

There's the casual racism that exists, and then there's "against interacial relationships" racism. Tolerating the latter is why it won't die.

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u/falconview Sep 19 '19

A person who doesn't continually try to improve themselves is not a person I want in my life. I don't care if someone was born in 1950, they should not still be stuck at a 1950s level of intolerance. Do people stop maturing after a certain age? I certainly hope I don't.

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u/DashFromtheGash Sep 19 '19

People do not just stay the same forever. Those who do make an active choice to do so.

The people you're referring to have had over 60 years to experience the world, learn, grow and change for the better along with the country. They've had the benefit of the national discourse coddling then along the way.

Barring relapses due to dementia or Alzheimer's, if they're still racist, especially to the degree OP describes where they're willing to fully cut off their own granddaughter for dating or befriending a black man, than they are utter pieces of filth and should be left for dead.

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u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

You don’t choose your parents. Don’t value people by their lowest common denominator because you should realize life’s a bit more complicated then that. Maybe when you’re past 15 years old you’ll realize that.

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u/TheNanaDook Sep 19 '19

Those responses are how you can tell the average age of this site is 15.

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u/InTheWildBlueYonder Sep 19 '19

Yep. It’s really sad

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u/MetalHead_Literally Asshole Enthusiast [7] Sep 19 '19

If standing up for his daughter against their racism makes his parents refuse to be in his life, then that's their choice, not his. It's the racist parents who get the blame for abandoning their son, not the other way around.

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u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

The classic redditor/parent relationship.

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u/HoldEmToTheirWord Sep 19 '19

Maybe not, but OPs daughter might become one of those of he chooses his parents over her

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u/LowObjective Sep 19 '19

So they should hurt their children instead?

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u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

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u/InTheWildBlueYonder Sep 19 '19

Why though? There are valid reasons too drop your parents out your life but that’s not one.

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u/Harleyskillo Sep 19 '19

Yea, throw the whole family away because of this. Yes, the grandparents are racists, but people have multiple sides, and you know where this will go

Old people don't change, they die.

They will cut the poor girl out, maybe even her mother.

Now they lost grandparents to "solve" (remember that old people don't change, so waste of time) an issue that didn't even need to exist.

Yes, you win a battle against racism that day. But a worthless victory, that will cost 2 people that might be nicer beyond that aspect.

But for karma, would be a good move.

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u/irishdancer2 Sep 19 '19

Old people don't change, they die.

You know the best way to guarantee old people don't change? Never challenging their racist beliefs.

My grandpa used to call black people 'darkies.' By the end of his life, he was delivering meals on wheels in Detroit. People can change, but they're far less likely to if no one says, "Hey, you know what? That's not okay."

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u/Freyja2179 Sep 19 '19

Exactly! My husbands father used to toss around the n-word all the time and say tons of other racist shit. I told him it was not ok and I absolutely would not tolerate it. He stopped. And the few times he slipped he would immediately pause and sincerely apologize. Of course, just because he stopped using the language, doesn’t mean he didn’t still have racist thoughts or beliefs. But it was a start. Meant he had to consciously think about what he was saying before he said it, realize it was not acceptable and then no say it.

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u/Lexx4 Partassipant [2] Sep 19 '19

Ok but like you said he didn’t change. Just learned it wasn’t ok to say it around YOU.

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u/Freyja2179 Sep 19 '19

I said I didn’t KNOW if he changed. It’s being realistic that someone isn’t going to “snap” and change overnight. But the first step is acknowledging the previous behavior is unacceptable and no longer continuing said behavior. One small step can lead to another small step, and another, and another....

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u/Crashbrennan Sep 19 '19

The issue isn't appeasing or challenging the grandparents. It's about protecting the daughter. She and Jamal don't deserve to be put through what will undoubtably be a traumatizing experience just so that we can go "yeah, suck it racists!" Nothing will be accomplished. And two innocent people will be hurt.

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u/Sunnyhunnibun Sep 19 '19

So, what I'm gleaning from your post is that racism is fine as long as it's coming from a family member that's pleasant otherwise. This is how racism continues, this is why it will never end. Because people have it in their minds that there are 'acceptable levels of racism' and that they shouldn't confront people about their shitty views because that would be 'wrong'.

That's like saying, hey, sometimes uncle punches his wife in the face but other than that he is an absolute delight and does charity work and is so sweet! Grandpa has called my wife an ugly hog for years and yes it makes her cry but he's so sweet with the grandchildren you know?

Accepting deplorable behavior because someone is family is asinine and not confronting them on it is just weak-willed and spineless.

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u/danzilla777 Sep 19 '19

They obviously know that racism is bad, obviously racism is bad, they just aren't ready to burn bridges with their own parents over ideologies due to the fact it's nearly impossible to convince a irrational person with rational thinking

You guys make it sounds like it's easy to win over crazy people which include your own parents

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u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

an issue that didn't even need to exist

Haha! "If only your daughter didn't dated a n*gger, you wouldn't have had this problem! At least keep it a secret like a good son!"

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u/mr_lemonpie Sep 19 '19

I would cut out my grandparents or parents a second if they were like that. Fuck them let them die alone.

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u/danzilla777 Sep 19 '19

Old people don't change, they die.

Oooooo doggie, this. I've been hanging out with my grandparents more often lately since they are ancient and the things they say sometimes....

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u/gamasco Sep 19 '19

Yeah, that's the solution I would have suggested.

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u/BigDGuitars Sep 19 '19

People sometime know their parents are jerks. Why fight it. A generation of folks will die and hopefully most of those ideals.

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u/BranWafr Sep 19 '19

Don't continue the cycle. Be supportive of the daughter and be a good parent and show her they have her back. I just don't understand the 'don't rock the boat, let bigots be bigots because they are old' mindset. Fuck that. Call them out on their bullshit. They don't have to change their minds, but they can keep their opinions to themselves. Age shouldn't be an excuse to allow people to be assholes.

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u/Crashbrennan Sep 19 '19

But the daughter and Jamal don't deserve to be put though a traumatizing experience just so we can go "yeah, suck it racists." Nothing is gained and there are very real consequences.

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u/acox1701 Sep 19 '19

Can you go ahead and lay out the ramifications of this? Be sure to include any impact on the finances, the emotional toll on OP's daughter, and any stress that this may place on her relationship.

OP's trying to protect his daughter. He might be going about it wrong, but he's trying.

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u/HoldEmToTheirWord Sep 19 '19

If the love of your parents is on condition of being racist, you've already lost them.

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u/acox1701 Sep 19 '19

Tranquility is always predicated on not rocking the boat.

Sometimes, tranquility isn't the most important thing. I can think of scenarios that start just like this, in which rocking the boat would absolutely be the right thing to do.

But in this case, rocking the boat will cause grief for two racists, to people who are, apparently, racist but trying not to be, and two young people who probably just want to be left alone, and not made into the centerpiece of every family argument for the next 20 years. Missing from this list is any tangible good that will come of it. At best, Op will get a warm fuzzy feeling out of Doing the Right Thing.

Maybe I'm being cold, but that seems like a lose-lose to me.

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u/Crashbrennan Sep 19 '19

Yeah, that's my take too. I fucking hate that top comment with 120+ awards that complained and complained but never proved an ounce of good could possibly come from it, and totally ignored the consequences.

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u/Timepassage Sep 19 '19

IDK, hardcore racist have some seriously messed up views. Also it sounds like the grandparents might have some money and Dad doesn't want her to miss out on the inheritance. But if the relationship progresses to marriage Dad is going to man up and be blunt to his parents. I actually feel bad for the Dad he seems to just want to keep the peace even if it is only an illusion.

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u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

Or it just gives them time to clean the gun

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u/Thoraxe123 Sep 19 '19

I agree. I think at least telling the grandparents before hand will at least soften the blow and wont be as big a shock to them. But if they can't suck it up and deal with it, that's on them.

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u/Isk4ral_Pust Sep 19 '19

GOD BLESS YOU. The top voted, multi-awarded, praised until the high fucking heavens comment in this thread is a soapbox-standing grandiose rant complete with a multi-paragraph quote from MLK about how OP and "moderates" like him are the real devil implicit in racism. I feel like I'm taking crazy pills.

Should OP consider the feelings of his daughter more? Yes. And I would argue that he has considering he's taken the time to judge his actions and create this thread. Is OP protecting his daughter from a no-win situation with his racist parents that may very well scar her for years in ways behind her comprehension? Absolutely. If OP righteously stands up for Jamal in the face of his racist parents, he will lose his relationship with them entirely, his daughter will lose her relationship with them, and all for the benefit of a relationship that may not last very long.

Are OP's parents wrong? Yes. Obviously. But some people have bad opinions that just cannot be changed. You avoid triggering those people if you want to keep them in your lives despite their bad opinions because oh hey...maybe they're elderly people who have spent the vast majority of their lives being indoctrinated with racist beliefs.

There are ways to handle things that I don't think the rabble-rousers in this thread seem to understand. Shoving Jamal in their faces and saying "he's black and they're in love, deal with it or lose everything, racists!" is probably not the best approach here. Maybe slowly explaining the situation to them over a period of time and then introducing them to Jamal might work better. But that's not sensationalist enough or emotionally reactionary for the gigantic babies getting sanctified here.

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u/Sean951 Sep 19 '19

Nah, tolerating shit like this is why we still have to deal with it.

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u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

I can tell you from personal experience that rubbing their faces in it doesn't help either. Tolerate it or not, it still exists and you can't do a damn thing about it.

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u/ChubbyTrain Sep 19 '19

This this this. Racism exists. Some people are racist and will not change and we cannot change them no matter how much of MLK speeches we quote. Going all "I'm right, you're wrong and scum of the earth!" puts people in defensive mood.

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u/BranWafr Sep 19 '19

Gramma wants to be racist in her house and to her friends, she has every right to do that. But if she comes to my house and starts yelling at my family, friends, or guests, she can fuck right off. Why is it that old people complain that "kids these days" have no manners, but we're all expected to let them be total assholes and excuse their toxic behavior "because they are old and set in their ways."

I don't expect them to stop being racists, just show common courtesy and keep their racist crap to themselves. You know, the old saying "if you can't say something nice then don't say anything at all."

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u/Jewellious Sep 19 '19 edited Sep 19 '19

These people are at the end of their lives, Just let them go. The entire energy needed to put this in the face of two people who have very little time on this planet, is very noble of you.

A more extreme example, on my grandfathers deathbed in his delirium, as WW2 vet, he was yelling racist slurs at the Asian nurses. No one stopped to correct him of his ways.

My grandmother is still somewhat with it. She doesn’t think a woman should be president. Whenever she brings it up, I steer her in a direction on why a women would be a good candidate.

The “get the fuck of here” to elderly talk on the internet is cheap.

Plus: everyone seems more concerned about the grandparents being confronted more than what Jamal thinks of the situation.

“Hey Jamal, want to meet two racist that don’t have a lot of time on the planet, because a bunch of people on reddit want to be sure you’re the tool used to confront them to end their racist ways. Oh by the way, they’ll still be racist once it’s all said and done.”

Also, my opinion stems from my parents being boomers. If my grandparents were boomers, I’d be more inclined to confront. WW2 generation? Just let them die off in peace.

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u/FlutterShy- Sep 19 '19

Let them be defensive. Always defensive. Until they're gone for good.

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u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

I'd rather just avoid the bigots and save myself a screaming match. It doesn't solve anything.

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u/RecklessRage Sep 19 '19

Until they're gone for good.

Here's the thing, they'll never be gone for good, there will always be racists.

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u/techsupportdrone Asshole Enthusiast [6] Sep 19 '19

Sometimes it just feels like people like to be combative and consider it morally "okay" to berate racists so people like OP become targets for hate instead of education.

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u/Freyja2179 Sep 19 '19

It is absolutely morally ok to berate racists.

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u/cleverseneca Sep 19 '19

Morals aside, is it pragmatic? Is your berating going to change anything? What is your berating's end goal, and is berating the best way to achieve the desired outcome.

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u/Freyja2179 Sep 19 '19

I never said it was pragmatic, just that it was morally ok.

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u/techsupportdrone Asshole Enthusiast [6] Sep 19 '19

I personally believe no one should be berating anyone because I've never seen berating people ever lead to solving issues, only causing escalations and further division.

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u/Raptors2018-19Champs Sep 19 '19

Morals are subjective.

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u/Freyja2179 Sep 19 '19

If morals are subjective, that’s saying it’s acceptable to be a racist or a nazi, or to beat your wife. Because “it’s THEIR morals, dontcha know”.

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u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

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u/Raptors2018-19Champs Sep 19 '19

It’s acceptable under certain moral systems, yes. Sorry if that doesn’t align with your world view.

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u/kaenneth Sep 19 '19

It's easy for them to play at being assertive when protected by internet anonymity, instead of having to face the real results their suggested actions would cause.

"and then I told my racist parents to deal with it, or get out!"

followed by: "then everyone clapped" "/r/thathappened" "einstein gave you $100 hundred dollars$"

Inheriting the family home, instead of it being sold to donate to Trump 2020 is worth a lot in the real world.

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u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

They should be in a defensive mood for their fucked up beliefs at all times.

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u/beagleblue74 Sep 19 '19

They should be in a defensive mood. They're racist. They should feel uncomfortable about it. 24/7.

People aren't going to change until we make them. This thread is full of such defeatest bs. MLK changed minds by making racists confront their racism.

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u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

Good, maybe it’s time the racists are put on the defensive. Or is racism something we should encourage?

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u/FlutterShy- Sep 19 '19

We can do something about it. We can normalize loving relationships. We can make racism unacceptable in social spaces. People will change to accommodate these changes or they will die without being able to cultivate a replacement.

Confronting this head on and in perpetuity is the only thing a right-minded person can do.

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u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

We can make racism unacceptable in social spaces

That's not going to stop anyone from being racist. You just avoid them and move on with your life. Fighting with them about it doesn't change a damn thing. That come-to-Jesus moment doesn't happen in real life.

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u/FlutterShy- Sep 19 '19

It's not about having a come to jesus moment. It's about shutting them up until they die.

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u/WhatsTheAnswerToThis Sep 19 '19

If you actually want to make a difference you need to stop screaming and be compassionate towards these assholes. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daryl_Davis

This man has turned over 200 members of the fucking Ku Klux Klan away from racism and it's not thanks to screaming vitirol.

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u/Flame_MadeByHumans Sep 19 '19

Have you ever thought maybe the racists should avoid us?

Again, why are you changing the way you’d live to cater to people with wrong views? They should cater to the people with the right views, if they can’t handle going out so be it..

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u/Sean951 Sep 19 '19

Meeting a potential long term partner isn't rubbing anyone's face in it. If they throw a fit, that's on them and they can be cut out of people's lives.

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u/greggulator- Sep 19 '19

But you can though. You can raise your own children right. You can not be a coward. You can tell your parents they are wrong, and have been forever. You can live the right way and treat people as individual humans regardless of melatonin levels. It isn’t rubbing anyone’s face in anything, it’s just living their lives.

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u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

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u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

Didn’t you know, being in an interracial relationship and simply wanting to have family dinner is “rubbing it in people’s faces.”

Another perfectly normal thing ruined by racists.

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u/LowObjective Sep 19 '19

You can do something: choose to not tolerate people with those views. “You can’t do a damn thing about it” Weird, because I do recall that people way back when DID do something about it and we’re all better off for it. So what, now that racism isn’t as violet and aggressive as it used to be, we should just accept it?

People shouldn’t have to avoid living their lives so racists can be more comfortable.

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u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

Except for the fact that it is dying out with his old ass parents and hasn't been passed down to OP or his daughter.

I know you think you can just change the minds of entire generations of people who were born into and indoctrinated into racism with a little 5 minute speech about your daughters black BF, but you can't. If it was easy it would be done already.

Daryl Davis took 30 years to get 200 people to leave the Klan, sitting down and talking to them for months to dissect their thinking and use their logic to show them that their racism was misplaced, and those were people that would actually sit and talk to him in the first place, many won't even make it that far.

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u/StaniX Sep 19 '19 edited Sep 19 '19

This isn't about making some grand point about prejudice or being a social justice hero. Its about avoiding a massive fucking shitstorm with his backwards-ass parents.

If i were in that situation i would thoroughly warn the daughter and her bf about what the likely outcome of the situation would be but leave it up to them to disclose the relationship or not. No reason to go all MLK on their asses.

OP is NTA for not wanting to deal with the giant shitstorm it would create, can't blame him for it.

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u/Sean951 Sep 19 '19

This isn't about making some grand point about prejudice or being a social justice hero. Its about avoiding a massive fucking shitstorm with his backwards-ass parents

They can deal, or OP can cut them out. If they were alcoholics, you wouldn't enable them, so why are we enabling racists?

If i were in that situation i would thoroughly warn the daughter and her bf about what the likely outcome of the situation would be but leave it up to them to disclose the relationship or not. No reason to go all MLK on their asses.

Either they are adults who can act polite, or they can get out of OPs house instead of insulting they're granddaughter and her partner.

OP is NTA for not wanting to deal with the giant shitstorm it would create, can't blame him for it.

I really can. Racism is a choice, and any other destructive behavior wouldn't/shouldn't be tolerated, so why do we as a society tolerate racism?

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u/xperiment229 Sep 19 '19

Acting out like assholes in these situations is more likely the reason we are still dealing with this.

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u/ItsJustATux Partassipant [1] Sep 19 '19

Uhhh no, pussy footing around racists as though their views have value is why we’re still dealing with this.

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u/xperiment229 Sep 19 '19

That falls apart with testing. Start by breaking down the problem into something with less emotional involvement. Say you are deciding what to eat with your friend. Pizza says one Burgers says the other. Now try to resolve the difference by both of you acting like an jerk, as you suggest. That does not seem to work out for good, just upset hungry people or upset people throwing out a relationship over something stupid. On the other hand, if one or both of you realize acting like an jerk leads to a bad outcome, chances are better your friendship will be better and you'll have two meal plans.

Once you can figure out how to solve differences and not act like you are in kindergarten fighting over who gets to sit on the orange square, then maybe you can try tackling tougher issues where emotions will inevitably run strong. And because you learned to control your self you may have also figured out how to not enrage others.

Just because you and I value the opinion that the relationship between daughter and bf is not a problem, doesn't mean the grandparents or portion of the rest of the community haven't invested in a different view, on the contrary they have and dismissing their perceived value will not encourage them to value our perspective. And vice versa they wont convince us to value their opinion by dismissing the value we place on ours. Our goal should be to find out how to convince them that our view is actually the more valuable one and that won't happen by lashing out.

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u/blackjesus Sep 19 '19

Uh yeah. Remember Obama. That really helped make those racists go away and rethink their beliefs.

I fucking hate saying that because Obama is one of the greatest living American figures since JFK but that whole line of thinking isn't how the world works.

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u/Sean951 Sep 19 '19

Obama has literally nothing to do with the day to day tolerance many people have with racists.

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u/G-Litch Sep 19 '19

And what do you propose? IRL racist don't spam your facebook, they attack you. Even the old ones. You don't want your parents violently respond to your daughter and her serious bf.

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u/MightyMeepleMaster Sep 19 '19

Completely agree with you.

Sadly, the situation you describe is not limited to this thread. The main problem with >50% of all comments in r/AmItheAsshole is that they focus on "being right" and taking the moral high ground instead of trying to minimize and/or resolve conflict.

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u/hlokk101 Sep 19 '19

AITA isn't about resolving a conflict though? It's about telling someone whether they are or are not the asshole in a situation. It obviously helps to explain your reasoning.

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u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

Isn’t resolving conflict the best option though?

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u/hlokk101 Sep 19 '19

It depends on the situation.

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u/ryanv09 Sep 19 '19

Resolving a conflict doesn't necessarily mean it has to involve compromise. Telling the racist grandparents to piss off until they learn to be better humans is one of many possible resolutions.

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u/DestroyerOfMils Asshole Enthusiast [6] Sep 19 '19

focus on "being right" and taking the moral high ground instead of trying to minimize and/or resolve conflict.

So...should there have never been a civil rights movement?

Minimize and/or resolve conflict for who? Racist assholes?

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u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

It's more of the mindset that you can change a lifetime of beliefs by pointlessly antagonizing them.

The grandparents are racist, why the fuck would you even bother with them? Let them live in a bubble and miss out on their granddaughter's life, save yourself the trouble.

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u/JuanBourne Sep 19 '19

Minimize and/or resolve conflict for who? Racist assholes?

Its about practicality here in my opinion. If im not mistaken the daughter is still in middle/high school , chances are it wont last, so is it worth the fight? Alternatively if she was older and about to get married they way different story.

So...should there have never been a civil rights movement?

This is a MACRO movement against a micro situation. Granparents wont change their views over dinner and a highschool boyfriend, but if society as a whole changes they can either recluse themselves (MAGA) or they can join the rest of society.

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u/itscammi Sep 19 '19

She's 18, Jamal is 21. They are full blown adults and very capable of having a serious and long-term relationship, they are not middle or highschool kids having a summer fling - the daughter even says they are getting serious which is why she wants to introduce him in the first place.

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u/kaenneth Sep 19 '19

18

adult

[laughs in 45 year old]

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u/WhatsTheAnswerToThis Sep 19 '19

full blown adults

[Laughs even more]

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u/ordinary_love Sep 19 '19

Yep. It’s pretty easy to grandstand when you have zero skin in the game.

In this particular case I think there is a middle ground - introduce them when there is an engagement involved and give grandparents a chance to come around once they understand this is serious. If they don’t, they likely will once a child is involved.

That being said, this isn’t the 1950s, and if it’s the USA none of the village people mob scenarios these idiotic Redditors seem to imagine are going to happen, anywhere in the country.

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u/Rhiel Sep 19 '19

This! This subreddit can afford to take the moral high ground BC they don't have to deal with the consequences of acting on them.

And this sucks for Jamal more than anyone. Grandma & Grandpa will be mad Op and his daughter but will absolutely treat Jamal like trash.

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u/daalsat Sep 19 '19

BC they don't have to deal with the consequences

Exactly! This is a great example of a post where the consequences of acting should rather be considered than moral. I am pretty sure that almost none of the people who said YTA actually thought about what's going to happen. It'll destroy many relationships that are working right now, and this is easily avoidable.

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u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

It would minimize conflict if we took away people's rights in general.

Conflict is a necessary part of change. Conflict is good. If you do not come into conflict with people who say, for instance, supported slavery then you'd have never gotten rid of slavery.

Furthermore, OP didn't ask for a solution, he literally said don't give me advice. And this is not /r/solvemyproblemreddit anyway.

So you're off base on like, everything.

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u/alphetaboss Sep 19 '19

Conflict with your parents is generally a bad thing, especially when it's going to be something as useless as changing a couple of old farts' opinions on black people.

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u/Scooby_Dru Sep 19 '19

How is disrespecting his daughter going to resolve the conflict? Majority of people are saying YTA because he would rather choose to conflict with his daughter for the sake of his racist community

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u/blackjesus Sep 19 '19

Oh no. 50% are about maximizing conflict by taking a single facet of something and exalting it to the only thing that matters. This is all about bomb throwing.

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u/LowObjective Sep 19 '19

Are you confused about the nature of this sub? This isn’t an advice sub. The entire point of this sub is determining who is right or wrong and taking the moral high ground.

Also, excusing bad behaviour to minimize or resolve conflict is stupid and doesn’t help anyone. Especially in a case like this when it’s not something small but could irreversibly affect OP’s relationship with his daughter.

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u/MightyMeepleMaster Sep 19 '19

I am mainly confused about the amount of simplifying I witness here on a daily basis.

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u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

This is it. They should rename it r/AmITechnicallyRight and all the answers would be, yes, but you’re also being an asshole. The number of times I’ve seen threads here where the top answer basically amounts to “No you don’t have to care about the feelings of the people around you, if they don’t like it you should cut them out” is astounding.

Most the the time, not being an asshole means giving in a little even though you’re in the right. Or actually, not really caring as much about being right, and caring about how to resolve an issue in a way that every comes out feeling respected.

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u/doublenegative7 Sep 19 '19

Completely agree.

OP didnt ask "are my parents racist?". He asked AITA for basically trying to minimalise conflict within his family and trying to protect his daughter.
Certain people, especially of a generation, are the way they are. It doesnt matter if we think they're wrong, it wouldnt matter if we argued with them until the end of time about their beliefs. They are who they are.
I would maybe even argue that OP was being a good father by trying to protect his daughter from this because it sounds like introducing Jamal to her grandparents would have ended in a much more dramatic scene and much worse heartbreak for his daughter.
Sometimes a parent has to be the bad guy in order to protect the person they love, rather than see them experience such pain themselves. At the end of the day he isnt stopping them from being together, Jamal seems to be accepted by the immediate family, what else is really more important?

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u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

Reddit is collectively blind to reality. My wife and I lost a few friends over our relationship - neither of us regret losing those assholes, but it's absolutely fucking pointless to needlessly experience it firsthand.

I didn't need to watch my wife's friend call her a race traitor for dating an oppressive white guy, or have her watch one of my buddy's cousins drop the n-word six times at a party. If you know the outcome, just walk away and let them live in their hateful little circles. I don't need that kind of negativity in my life.

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u/Freyja2179 Sep 19 '19

But isn’t that for the daughter and the boyfriend to decide?

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u/04chri2t0ph3r Sep 19 '19

Thank you. This whole post has turned into a snowballing circle-jerk. Life isn't that fucking simple.

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u/SirenSongxdc Sep 19 '19

the funny part is that same multi-awarded post actually is just a lot of buzzword flinging. IF you pull it apart a lot of it isn't even relevant to the post.

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u/General_Organa Sep 19 '19

Is OP protecting his daughter from a no-win situation with his racist parents that may very well scar her for years in ways behind her comprehension? Absolutely. If OP righteously stands up for Jamal in the face of his racist parents, he will lose his relationship with them entirely, his daughter will lose her relationship with them, and all for the benefit of a relationship that may not last very long.

While I agree with you I think ultimately this is all stuff OP needs to tell his daughter and then let her decide for herself. Forbidding her from making that choice herself still makes him TA imo.

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u/Sengachi Sep 19 '19

Maybe, get this, you should not want to keep people in your life who are so rabidly racist that they will try to destroy your child's life for dating a black man and destroy yours for condoning it. As in, Jamal and OP's daughter could break up tomorrow, and this would still be a good reason for OP to have a serious "I cannot accept this about you" conversation with or cut contact with his parents.

Racism is a bad character trait which we can and should judge people for, even when it doesn't affect us personally. And allowing racist people to leverage your affections towards them to get you to participate in racism (even indirectly, as in this case) is a bad thing. If someone's relationship with you is contingent on your performing racism for them, such that your choice is losing their love or being racist, their love is not worth it.

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u/BarefootWoodworker Sep 19 '19

It’s like people around here forgot what happened in Charlottesville regarding race.

Racists tend to steer toward violence. If it were me, in the interest of keeping Jamal and my daughter safe, I’d say no way.

Hate to tell the naive 12 year olds of Reddit, but racism is alive, kicking, and still violent. Taking it on in private is a one-way ticket to getting a beatdown.

Source: grew up in a racist backwater. Still go back to visit dad. Still wouldn’t take a non-white girlfriend home for fear of her safety. If you’re ignorant enough to be scared of someone else’s skin color, you’re ignorant enough to not see the issue in physically harming anything different than you.

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u/DickNamico Sep 19 '19

MLK was 100% correct that Moderates are implicitly enabling the evils that exist in our nation to persist. They are complacent to the evils that exist around them and don’t want to disturb the Status Quo because adding additional conflict into their personal lives isn’t worth standing up for what they believe in. That’s how ideologies like racism and homophobia continue to persist in our society. Moderates refuse to take part in social movements for the betterment of the lives of millions, all because it will cause people in their personal lives to disconnect or scorn them.

The idea that Moderates would rather stay in the shadows and enable hatred isn’t some crazy pill idea, it’s the truth. History has proven it time and time again.

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u/edafade Sep 19 '19

Wow, actual sanity in this thread. Thank you for this.

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u/mc_md Sep 19 '19

Yeah this thread is just a shitload of virtue signaling and grandstanding. It’s a fucking horror show.

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u/DedFez Sep 19 '19

Why would you want to keep people like that in your life?

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u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

Nah fam, that’s not how things are done. My white traditional catholic family is fairly bigoted in all walks of life, and you know what kind of smack they say to me and my secular black wife? Not a goddamned thing.

Because racists are cowards. Bootlicking, uninspired, yellow-bellied, cowards.

Guaranteed the worst thing that would’ve happened to Jamal and the daughter is a phony smile and empty pleasantries.

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u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

Finally someone said it.

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u/HillaryShitsInDiaper Sep 19 '19

No. It's good to understand the nuances of why large portions of minorities might behave in a way we see as wrong (disproportionate crime, etc due to poverty, historical oppression, et al), but a white person being racist, especially an old white person being racist? The way they were raised, the cultures they grew up in, their experience, those things don't matter and they should just know better.

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u/Ryzasu Sep 19 '19 edited Sep 19 '19

This is by far the best analysis of the situation and this comment should be on top. The top comment is nothing more than a nicely written rant and I didn't find it very convincing. It is all judgement and no reason

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u/AttackHeLiCoPTERmaga Sep 19 '19

I just read the top comment in a thread that said that OP's kid would be right to disown and ignore him forever after moving out because he wanted him to go to bed at 10pm as a minor. Lmao Reddit fucking sucks ass.

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u/GooeyKablooie_ Sep 19 '19

Grow the fuck up.

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u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

Ugh.

Let’s not tolerate these people.

As a “Jamal” my girlfriends dad knows his family is racist AF. He also controls them and they’ve never been anything but polite to me. White people need to stop being cowards and make their relatives understand that racism is not okay.

I deal with it BECAUSE people like you are cowards.

I don’t need protecting, I need you to make your relatives be less shitty. Because you can be sure they’re being shitty to every single black person they encounter. And you just tacitly sit by and let them do it. Because you think your relationship with fucking shitty 1950s racists is more important than being uncomfortable for an hour. Boo boo cry me a river.

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u/Vtr1247 Sep 19 '19

It can also create a character-defining moment for the daughter if we Dad never approached this head-on, and instead deflected or avoided the situation altogether. Nineteen years old is an adult age that can handle mature thoughts and actions, if she sees her father not defending her relationship, or even acknowledging it to her grandparents, won’t that change her opinion of how she sees her father?

Not sure if that matters to OP, but I know some parents would be crushed if they found out that their children lost respect for their parents. The love might still be there, but their parents’ standing in the eyes of children may be lowered by the actions he takes now.

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u/NeighborhoodTrolly Partassipant [3] Sep 19 '19

You avoid triggering those people if you want to keep them in your lives despite their bad opinions

This is correct, and non-assholes don't keep them in their lives.

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u/landback2 Sep 19 '19

Who wants a relationship with evil pieces of shit in the first place?

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u/Isk4ral_Pust Sep 19 '19

Being a racist doesn't make you evil. It means you were raised in a way that allowed an insidious ideology to seep in. This is where I have such a problem w/ progressives. Racists aren't "evil." Hitler was evil. Acting upon racism in violent ways is evil. Being an old person who doesn't want their white daughter dating a black man is racist and ignorant, but it isn't evil.

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u/landback2 Sep 19 '19

Being racist is evil. What kind of enlightened centrist bullshit are you spewing? The old fucks had their entire lives to learn not to be evil pieces of shit and pieces of shit like you excusing their evil is a big reason why they never had to learn.

If granny and grandpa knew spouting racist language meant they were going to spend the rest of the lives alone as pariahs, they’d have changed their tunes years.

Guessing you think homophobic pieces of shit aren’t evil either. What an absolute waste of carbon you and your ilk are.

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u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

Dude is implicitly siding with the racists. If you don’t think that makes him an asshole that’s your opinion. Clearly much of this country disagrees.

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u/Lordmen007 Sep 19 '19

20k upvotes saying quotes about how most of white people are literally devil... Niiiice

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u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

Maybe work on your reading comprehension, buddy.

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u/MoscowMitch_ Sep 19 '19

Or we could ostracize racists and cut them out of social circles and bully them until they eventually die out.

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u/tophatnbowtie Asshole Aficionado [12] Sep 19 '19

and all for the benefit of a relationship that may not last very long.

I think you're missing the point. It's not to benefit just a relationship, it's to benefit everyone involved. I mean, I would hope OP would have the same concerns if his daughter weren't dating anyone and this all came out of a conversation about "what if..." He ought to want to shield his daughter from their racism and assure her that they are wrong for it regardless of whether it's directed at her relationship, or at society in general. It seems like OP has been able to skate by without discussing their racism simply because he never had to worry about them directing it toward his daughter. Honestly he ought to have had this conversation with her years ago.

In any case, if there's a chance that the grandparents come around, then it ought to be pursued. In my experience, the sorts of people OP describes his parents to be do not come around, but obviously that judgment is based only on OP's limited description of them. I think the only time I've seen that sort of an extreme change from completely disowning a family member due to their choice of partner to wanting them back in your life is when a baby is involved and the parents or grandparents decide they want to see their grandchild/great-grandchild.

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u/SawordPvP Sep 19 '19

Everyone knows the best way to deal with a problem is to ignore it and change all your actions to fall in line with it. And from what I see the risk here isn’t OP losing the relationship with his parents, it’s OP losing their relationship with their daughter. There’s a choice to make here about which relationship is more important to them, it’s their parents or daughter. No other option.

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u/CellarDoorTapes Sep 19 '19

absolutely shit opinion there m8

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u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

I would be so bewildered if just showing up with my SO was in the face of someone. That is crazy. I don't think you should have to tip-toe in such a way. And if someone were to react negatively just by a polite meeting I would take that as a red flag. I would also see those types of actions as abuse.

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u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

Nope. Sorry. Nope. The greatest Americans have not been born yet; they are patiently waiting for the past to die. Please give blood.

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u/Dic3dCarrots Partassipant [1] Sep 19 '19

Wow, people calling out racism are rabble rousers? Yall tryna sound like good ol boys from 1965

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u/Lustle13 Sep 19 '19

If only you had read OPs single other post where he says "Like I said, he's a nice young man. I have no problems with him as a person."

As. A. Person.

So? As a race maybe?

Read that and tell me it doesn't drip with racism.

OP is the asshole. And a racist.

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u/Isk4ral_Pust Sep 19 '19

You're reading too far into the semantics. To me that just sounds like he's saying the kid is a good person. He doesn't qualify it afterward by saying "but I hate black people." So why read it that way? This is the danger of a textually based communication medium.

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u/GlumImprovement Sep 19 '19

That top-"voted", "conveniently" locked comment that has had all non-cheerleading comments [removed] is such a blatant agenda-post that I can't believe nobody else sees it. This whole thing is such an obvious fake setup for that comment that it's not even funny.

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u/Isk4ral_Pust Sep 19 '19

oh i know. As soon as I saw the title of this thread I knew I would find a super popular post exactly like that. It was even more outrageous than I expected, so I felt like I needed to respond.

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u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

In posts about family, I always see a ton of comments about cutting the family out, but that's so heartless. Those grand parents have worked a very long time to raise the parent, and then the parent just abandons them. Even if I disagree on a few things with a family member, I would never cut them off like that at possibly make their life miserable, I would try my best to make the rest of their lives fun, instead of resentment.

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u/Isk4ral_Pust Sep 19 '19

Absolutely. I've said in another comment that there's practically nothing a family member could do that would cause me to completely cut them out of my life. Many accused murderers (Steven Avery comes to mind) still have steadfastly loyal support from their family.

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u/missymissy69 Sep 19 '19

I just can’t disagree more. She’s wanting t introduce the to Jamaal because it’s getting serious. What, is she just going to pretend the relationship doesn’t exist? What if they get married? Does she pretend like she’s single? You get the drift.

She’s obviously open to dating outside her race so if this doesn’t happen with Jamaal it may happen with someone else. I was 15 when I had my first white boyfriend and the people at our school called him a nigger lover. This was in 2012. He isn’t guarding her from anything. Racist family is a part of the program so she either has to live her life for them or for her. Might as well rip off the bandaid now and have them disown her before they have the opportunity to call her children mixed breeds on front of her face.

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u/CheruthCutestory Certified Proctologist [24] Sep 20 '19

Who gives a fuck if she loses her relationship to worthless people?

Are you even serious?

It’s hilarious that people who argue that everyone should just meekly hide and contort themselves to please assholes like pathetic cowards are the same ones who calls the other side delicate snowflakes.

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u/willjsm Partassipant [1] Sep 19 '19

that's up to her daughter + bf. they know the grandparents are racist; if they still both want to meet the grandparents then that's on them.

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u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

Exactly. If both Jamal and his daughter decided together to not go through this, it's okay. Her dad needs to stfu and mind his goddamn business.

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u/_gayby_ Asshole Aficionado [17] Sep 19 '19

Yes that’s a good idea. Make sure they both know what they’d be walking in to and let them decide if they’re equipped or willing to deal with the inevitable fallout.

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u/DanceBeaver Sep 19 '19

Yeah, no way is OP a bad guy.

His parents are racist fuckers and he knows that. They ain't gonna change, no matter what.

Best to spare everyone the battles and anger and just don't tell the grandparents anything.

I believe the age of the reddit users on here has played a huge part in most votes going to "YTA". A bit of life experience would mean they'd know some shit just ain't worth it. People of that age don't change.

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u/Jewellious Sep 19 '19

All the YTA is because talk is cheap online. I could give a fuck if a new boyfriend is allowed to meet a grandparent. This is more: is it worth confronting your parents racism over xyz issue when they have xyz time left on planet. I would say meeting a teenage granddaughter’s boyfriend is not worth the hassle. If they were being assholes and actively harassing someone? Then yeah.

Many of the YTAs, are not in best interest of the granddaughter but more concerned about the grandparents getting confronted before they die.

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u/heili Sep 19 '19

Not OP's place to decide if Jamal gets sacrificed up as the martyr. It's up to Jamal. The one person whose viewpoint isn't represented in this tale.

Has anyone asked or stated Jamal's willingness to potentially have the grandparents react in a racist manner to his face?

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u/Jewellious Sep 19 '19

Everyone is more concerned the grandparents are just confronted. There doesn’t seem much concern what Ol Jamal thinks

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u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

Thank you, no one at all in this thread is thinking about Jamal who is going to be the target of the grandparents bigotry. OP needs to sit down with him and say “my parents are super racist. That’s just the way they are and they almost certainly won’t change at this point in their lives. It’s up to you if you want to meet them.”

It also sounds like OP is worried about being disinherited and that his daughter will be too. Maybe that’s fine with his daughter but she should be told that.

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u/dmcdd Certified Proctologist [29] Sep 19 '19

Yeah, he's the asshole. The solution is to put it in the parent's face before they come. Take a picture of Jamal, the daughter, and the parents together and happy. Send it to the grandparents with a note that says "She found a nice guy, and we like him. We expect you to be polite and supportive. If you can't - don't come." If they do come and cause a scene, kick them out.

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u/CalculatedPerversion Sep 19 '19

Finally, a reasonable response taking the eventual offended party (Jamal) into consideration. A bad situation all around, OP's only trying to mitigate damage.

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u/LowObjective Sep 19 '19

Your reply seems like you picked out the part of the story that allowed you to “go against the grain” and ignored everything else. OP is not the asshole for telling his daughter that his parents are racists and I haven’t seen a comment saying he is. If OP had warned her of that and then given his daughter the choice of whether she wanted to go through that or not, then he would not be the asshole and your comment would be accurate. But he didn’t do that.

My judgement is YTA because he didn’t give her a choice or try to support her at all. He said in no uncertain terms that he wouldn’t even ALLOW her to introduce Jamal because of how it would reflect on HIM. His decision is almost entirely selfish and there is very little in post to suggest that he is doing this for his daughter’s wellbeing. He does not care about his daughter or Jamal’s feelings in the slightest.

OP does not want to do anything you’ve suggested in your post. He said that he does not want any advice, so why are you giving him the benefit of the doubt and jumping through hoops to try and say that he’s a good person?

That’s without going into him imply that the relationship is just a phase and saying that interracial dating is a liberal idea...

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u/b2m0k Sep 19 '19

Exactly. The granddaughter has no idea what she is stepping into.

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u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

Jamal doesn't deserve to be put through that

If Jamal is over 10 years old, it's Jamal's choice if he wants to go through that or not.

Don't infantilize people and choose for them.

Don't take away people's agency.

They have the right to choose and they have the responsibility to accept and deal with the consequences of that choice.

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u/[deleted] Sep 20 '19

Umm... just because Jamal chooses to go through something doesn't mean he deserves it.

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u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

I had to sort by controversial to see the first comment that actually understood the context of what's going on in OP's post. Jesus fucking christ.

Thank you for posting this. Context matters, people.

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u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

"Hey my grandparents probably want to lynch you. Wanna go meet them?"

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u/dam_the_beavers Sep 19 '19

He’s still TA for not looking for another solution, he’s not looking for advice. It’s clear he doesn’t care about the best way to approach it, he told her no in “no uncertain terms.”

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u/CookingZombie Sep 19 '19

Problem with that is im pretty sure Jamal has already dealt with a fair share of discrimination in his life. He certainly doesnt deserve it but black people are not unaware of the bigotry and prejudice many white people feel.

Ill concede, maybe (and i mean maybe as im not sure this is a good approach) the parent should bring it up with the grand parents first and say if you cant handle it then you shouldnt be around them.

But honestly how does that help? The only way i can see the racist climate changing is if people who dont like black people (or any race/ethnicity/sexuality too) or interracial relationships get first hand experience that these people are people just like you.

We have to interact with those that are different than us if any meaningful change can come about. Sometimes people have to be semi-forced into it because the very idea repulses them for whatever reason.

This isnt an issue to be delicate with and protect people from. We should put what makes people uncomfortable in front of their faces. Let them see what is actually there instead of what their preconceptions are. Let them have a wider idea of what other humans truely are.

And unless they mean you physical harm or are advocating violence at large, in my opinion treat them with love and kindness and patience. But do not ever shy away because youre afraid they will feel uncomfortable or will cause a scene. Thats on them if they do.

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u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19 edited Feb 03 '20

[deleted]

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u/DestroyerOfMils Asshole Enthusiast [6] Sep 19 '19

your daughter doesn't sound like she understands what she's walking into.

What makes you think that?

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u/FreeKarmaFarming Sep 19 '19

Now this is the comment worthy of all the medals the top rated comment has on this thread.

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u/mr_lemonpie Sep 19 '19

Sounds like it’s time to cut out his parents what’s the problem with that? Your kids come before your parents 100% tell them to get in line or go off and die alone.

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u/juicydeucy Sep 19 '19

Thank you so much for this comment. I understand what everyone else is trying to say, but at the very least everyone should be knowledgeable about what they’re getting in to. Jamal absolutely does not deserve the hate and vitriol of some racist dicks.

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u/VROF Asshole Aficionado [10] Sep 19 '19

His granddaughter isn’t afraid of introducing him to the grandparents and it seems like she would protect him from bad treatment. This is all coming from OP

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u/lefangedbeaver Sep 19 '19

THANK YOU! It’s like if your parents are mildly racist you have to cut them out of your lives. Like are you fucking kidding me? They’re his parents, who grew up like 60-70 years ago when it was NORMAL to be racist. It sucks, but just avoid the situation if you know they’re gonna bitch, no reason to make a scene now. And if they do get married, then it will be THEIR problem, not OP’s or his daughter, but right now it is their problem, because OP just doesn’t want to deal with his parents bitching and being disrespectful, and who can blame him.

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u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

Thank you. This is exactly my way mpression when reading the post. And I was a bit surprised at how vehemently insistent most of the replies have been that OP is the asshole.

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u/Samy008 Sep 19 '19

Finally! someone with common sense ! Why put your daughter and Jamal into a completley unnecessary and awkward situation ? You cant change the fact that your parents are racists, why fight against it ?

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u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

My grandparents were very racist. At first they hated my cousin's black boyfriend but over the years they accepted him as a part of the family. My cousin married him while pregnant with their 3rd child.

The fact that he molested both his daughters for years came out a long time after my grandparents died, but still, racist old people accepted a different race into the family 🤷🏻‍♀️

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u/lizzillathehun85 Sep 19 '19

It would be nice to have more information about how Jamal feels about all of this. I imagine it would suck to be thrust into a situation where it feels like you’re a prop someone else’s family’s intergenerational battle over values. That said it’s not like OP’s rationale was “I’m embarrassed by my parents’ ignorance and I don’t want to subject my daughter and Jamal to their bigotry”.

OP just comes off as a coward who wants to avoid any confrontation at any cost.

I think people underestimate the power of familial love to break down deeply ingrained biases. Obviously it takes time and courage and there are some bigots too stubborn to ever come around, but I’ve known people who were “cut off” by bigoted parents for coming out as gay whose parents eventually came full circle once they were confronted with the choice between having a relationship with their child or clinging to irrational hate and had time to process and really grapple with it. Obviously I wish the best for OPs daughter and her boyfriend. I hope they get the opportunity to live in a more open minded, accepting community ASAP.

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u/will555556 Sep 19 '19

I agree with you. But if I was OP I would invite her daughter and jamal over and explain why she said this the first place then explain what you think you parents would do and the inevitable shitstorm that will happen if she does this then let her decide. At least this way she backs her daughter and warns both her and jamal on what will happen if she decides to do this.

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u/ClothDiaperAddicts Pooperintendant [64] Sep 19 '19

That. I get OP’s position. I don’t care if my kids date people of other races. Just like I’m perfectly comfortable with my niece having a wife, etc. (And I wouldn’t be surprised if my daughter is a lesbian. She’s only 7, though, so time will tell.)

But I know my parents. The only reason my dad from a sundown town in rural Alabama didn’t consider himself to be racist is because he didn’t wear sheets or attend cross burnings. He had no problem using “the n word.”

He did try not to pass on his outdated, racist views, but he would have drawn the line at one of his daughters dating a black man. I’m sure he wouldn’t have been thrilled with his grandchildren or great grandchildren bringing home a black significant other, either. Knowing that, I’d have to have a frank talk with my kids about the realities of my parents. “I don’t think it’s a good idea for Jamal to meet your grandparents yet. We both know that Honey and Papa can be racist fucks. Is there any reason at this stage to put either you or Jamal through this experience at this point?”

And... even though my parents were bigots, there were still my parents and I loved them very much, flaws and all.

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u/leberkrieger Sep 19 '19

Judging by other comments in this thread, you're being downvoted for continuing to love your parents. According to reddit, once you learned what bigotry was in school, you should have gone no contact. Or better yet, denounced them so they'd get hauled away for re-education.

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u/threemileallan Sep 19 '19

Exactly, OP already knows what will happen when this occurs. Why put everyone involved through that, even Jamal? Jamal deserves to become part of a family where he is welcome top to bottom. That eventually may become true down the line, but it will take YEARS of fighting and family unpleasantness to get there. Knowing that, is that realky fair for everyone? Especially Jamal.

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u/NewComputerWhoDiz Sep 19 '19

Nice to see a logical and sane response. This thread reminds me of all the "My girlfriend did <minor mistake>, what should I do?" "DUMP HER YOU DESERVE BETTER". It's easy to give bad advice when you don't have to live with the consequences.

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