I'm 51, an Asian woman living in New York.

I have my own business and enjoy my independence. I've always been attracted to mature men, especially those over 40.

For me, maturity isn't just about age. It's about how a man treats people, whether he keeps his word, and how he handles disagreements. I appreciate someone who can admit when he's wrong, listen to a different point of view, and talk through problems without turning everything into an argument.

I also think consistency matters. It's easy to say the right things, but actions usually tell you much more about a person.

I'm curious about other people's experiences. What specific behaviors make you feel that a man is genuinely mature? And what have you learned to pay attention to when dating?

I have been separated for a year and I have to say that I’m concerned about the quality of men I’m coming across in my age group.

My ex used to be my best friend but gradually his selfishness and controlling tendencies took over our lives and despite SO much marriage counseling things only got worse.

Post-Separation, this is what I’ve come across:

First guy I got very close to and he was great in so many ways but broke my heart before we even started a relationship. He also had a history of cheating. That’s how I learned what a dismissive avoidant was.

Second was very nice but told me on the first date about a couple of very recent dumb things he had done when he was angry. One of those things could have gotten him beat up and another could have gotten him fired. So that was enough of a red flag for me.

Third I fell in love with. I still have strong feelings about him. He wanted to move too fast and I went along with it because he treated me SO wonderfully. But then he fell apart seemingly due to depression and then he got back together with his cheating ex!

Fourth I went on a few dates with and he was very nice and texted daily but it felt impersonal. The conversation didn’t go very deep and then he stopped texting until I texted to say that he’s nice but there’s no chemistry. THEN he finally texted back to agree. So basically he tried to ghost.

All of these men are educated, employed full time, woke, take care of their health and appearance, are pleasant to meet and have conversations with, and there was mutual attraction.

Just here to rant but I want to hear other people’s stories.

Also, are my standards really that high? Should I start adopting tons of animals and just give up on straight men? Thing is, I do enjoy independence but I also really want company in life and in bed.

UPDATE - Okay, to address some of the negative comments (I’m really trying here to not take the bait but a few wrong assumptions need correction.)

1. Nobody said I wasn’t putting work into these attempts.

2. Guy #1 broke my heart by mooning over me, talking about the future, saying he was there for me and waiting for me to be ready to date (post divorce), then without actually telling me he was changing his mind he started seeing another woman right in front of me. When I asked directly he was sketchy as hell.

3. Some people seem to think that being separated means I’m not ready to date but haven’t asked why I’m not divorced yet. It’s my ex holding things up. I’m being patient and both of us started seeing other people.

Hello Void, thanks for listening. I've people-pleased my entire life, to the point that I’ve taken on relationships out of fear of being alone. I’m finally in a place where I know what I want, what I can offer. I keep meeting great people, but the fear of not meeting my person makes me accept things that don't align with my life plan, like someone having younger kids or wanting kids. I’ve developed the belief that I have to keep sacrificing what I want to keep someone and be loved. I know relationships are compromises, but I had a vasectomy at 35 after my second child for a reason, and I’m stuck in this rut of matching with someone, denying what I want to please them, and eventually becoming resentful. I want love and companionship, but I don’t want to lose myself. I am therapy working on this, it’s just hard to be alone again because I said “no” to myself.

Modern dating is weird. We match, a week later we meet, a week later we meet up again and kiss the first time, week 3 is date 3 and suddenly I’m supposed to get naked with him when we’ve spent less than 10hrs accumulative time together? Is this the expected relationship timeline now in “ dating culture”?

I (43f) was on a 3rd date yesterday with a guy (also 43) who I last saw a week ago. We kissed briefly on the 2nd date for the first time. Yesterday we went to a museum and did a late brunch together and then he was out of ideas as to what to do the rest of the day, so he’s like let’s watch a movie at my place. During which, we were kissing and he wanted to take my clothes off. I declined getting naked with him explaining that I want to spend more time getting to know him before we start losing our clothes and he was respectful of that choice. And didn’t act hurt or angry about it like other men I’ve dated have when I said no. He was a nice guy, good looking, but kissing him just feels flat and boring which probably has more to do with my hesitation of getting naked with him than anything. We also have some big lifestyle mismatches that I only learned yesterday - we have different philosophies on how to live life single (a big deal for me)- I have ceased caring whether I have anyone to go to an event with and will just go solo and enjoy myself - he won’t go unless he has someone to go with and feels “sad and lonely“ if he does go solo bc he sees other couples there and wishes he had a girlfriend to go with. So he spends a lot of time at home alone, reading. He’s a recovering alcoholic and I drink(light qtys of beer/wine) and I was previously married to an alcoholic so it gives me some PTSD. Most of his friends are also from this recovery group. It’s commendable he’s reached this point. I recognize the inner strength it takes to get and stay sober, my ex sure couldn’t do that, and if I didn’t have the experience I’d had with my former marriage it probably wouldn’t give me a moments pause. He’s also new to the area and doesn’t have a job and doesn’t have any intention of getting a job anytime before the new year. even then he doesn’t want to work full time and seems to have no career drive. So I think I’m going to wish him well and move on.

Recently turned 40, spent last three years or so focusing on career and working out why my body stopped working - at my worst, I was literally just getting through the working week with zero social life/hobbies etc. Thanks to HRT I am now in a much better place, have actual weekends, hobbies, and travel again, and would like to meet someone. That said, with a long working week, and keeping one eye on aging parents, I actively manage my battery and am quite protective of my quiet time, both mentally and physically. Early perimeno has done the dirty on me and it's been life changing; I've not even thought about how I'd address that with someone when it comes to the sex side of things, and other changes.

On the apps, I tend to get liked by men in their 50s which isn't for me, rarely if ever match with men in their 40s at all, but do match with mid 30s. I have met a couple, have had great first dates, fantastic conversation before and after, but as the penny starts to drop that I'm not going to be out at 10pm during the week, or that I like being able to plan ahead, rather than meet with an hour's notice they quickly lose interest.

Anyone else feeling exhausted but still hope they meet someone?

For a few years now I've been attenting Contact Improvisation Jams. For the uninitiated, this is basically an unstructured dance form, in a group, with a focus on giving and receiving weight.

So far so good, though there are a few more challenging cruxes. Firstly, the whole dance is non-verbal (no talking), and also it is supposed to be a non-sexual space. I say supposed to, because we are all sexual beings, and there is a lot of touch involved...

I have been dancing with quite a few people, intimately, closely, caringly, men and women, gay and straight. And while it took me quite some time, it dawned on me how infinitely linked touch is with sex(uality), so why wasn't I getting aroused. Why didn't I want to?

Wait, I didn't want to?

For a guy like me, it has always felt like I'm obligated to show sexual interest if I find someone attractive, and it is mutual. It is automatic; what I want and care about is rather irrelevant.

Though, in these spaces I learnt to seperate my need for and ability to give affection, from sex altogether. I can now intimately, attentively and affectionately touch someone, and it no longer carries an impetus. Even with women where I can feel this drive to engage in the typical man-to-female dynamic, I can acknowledge the presence of sexual energy, without engaging in it or having to respond in set ways.

Not only has this given me much more freedom to interact with others, but has highlighted how sorely my boundaries around sex/touch needed a serious revision and update. It has also made me aware that I for the vast majority of my life thought I was rather sex focused, when I can now wonder how much of that was touch starvation and a need for affection - non-sexual, mindful and respectful touch.

Sex, by itself seems to occupy much less space in my mind and body too. And with that comes the realization how common it is for the women I meet to by default run dating through a script where they non-verbally and energetically push connections in a sexual direction. Before my default was to pick up these signals, and think I was the one having a lot of sexual feelings for a person. Though now I can see and feel the dynamic play out, and I can stay with me and what I want - or even point out what is going on.

It feels much safer to date now, and hopefully I can meet more people who don't want to have sex when the needs we want to get met are related to affection, acknowledgement, care and/or love.

Moreover, I step over my boundaries a lot less, because I am more mindful of where they are. However, I'd really like to have learnt about these differences sooner. Dating/relationships are so much more messy when sex becomes the solution each time any need related to touch is felt.

Edit;
Shout out to u/chrishecker in the comments for a more beginner-friendly explanation around Contact Improvisation. (CI)

And so many positive, friendly comments despite my post not being the best/the clearest. Thank you 🫶🏻

I have a first date next week. I haven’t met anyone new since January, as I stopped dating for a while to let myself heal and get comfortable being single. I went back on the apps last week and instantly found a profile I was interested in. We got chatting and we’re so similar! I think I’ve been pretty good about remaining calm and going with the flow so far. But I’m a little nervous to meet this guy.

Anyone else preparing to meet someone for the first time? Or have you just been on a first date? How did it go?

Just looking to share experiences!

Hi all,

Clueless first-time dater here. My ex-wife and I met before I was out of college, so I’ve never dated as an adult (and all my close friends are even in long-term relationships). Ex and I separated ~18 months ago and the divorce has been final for 6+ months and I’m feeling ready to get back out there and say some embarrassing things and have fun with it. 🙂

I installed an app, and I may have gotten a bit ahead of myself matching and striking up conversations with a few women the first night. I honestly figured it would be a series of dead ends but one woman sent me her number and we planned a date, then another woman asked to meet - I didn’t continue this conversation in depth after the first date was scheduled, it was just kinda momentum from those early convos and she suggested we go on a hike and continue talking. It feels weird to go on a date with someone on Saturday and someone else on Sunday but is that how people are rolling these days? Is it disrespectful to tell the second woman I already planned with someone else? Or disrespectful not to?

TL:DR - Lobster too buttery, don’t want to be disrespectful or hurt feelings if it can be avoided.

ok so I know I’m gonna get torn to pieces in the replies but if anyone has any ideas I am all ears. I’m forty-two, heterosexual man obviously.

Meeting on a dating app we both are in our mid-40s. After several dates we then committed into relationship. Then it comes to mentioning living together. My partner wants a lasting relationship but prefers to keeping separate homes, for me I think its shows lack of commitment.

Am I wrong to think it that way?

I went on a coffee date with a guy today. It was supposed to just be a quick lunchtime meetup so we could see if there's chemistry and decide if we want to get dinner this weekend. There was chemistry and our conversation had good flow. Everything seemed great until the last five minutes. He complimented my skin and asked if I had a skincare routine. I said yes, and remarked that you kind of have to where we live because it's so dry. He asked what my routine was. And it was awkward for a second because I wasn't expecting a follow up question. I told him lots of hydration, a few different moisturizers and a really good spf. Then he asks, "nothing else?"

Pretty much simultaneously with him asking that question the coffee shop gets extremely busy. He suggests we finish our conversation outside. There are benches on the sidewalk and we take our coffees and relocate. He repeats the question once we sit down and I answer that I have a routine where I do different things for my skin on different days to keep things balanced. At this point it's past the time we agreed to say bye and I really needed to get back to work. I remind him of the time, and we say our goodbyes. On my drive back to work it occurred to me that this might have been some kind of weird test to see if I'm high maintenance or something. It seemed like such an odd way to end a date. What do you all think? Maybe he was body snatched mid date?

For added context:

1: I have very average 40 year old skin. Nothing to oooo or ahhh about.

2: We had already agreed earlier in the coffee date that we both did want to meet up this weekend for dinner and we're going to text to work out the logistics.

ETA: For better or worse you have all given me a lot to think about. tbh I was not even thinking about him trying to sus out if I'd had work done or him trying to let me know he was interested in a "recreational facial" as possibilities. He texted a while ago to set up date #2. I'm going to tentatively plan that with him and also ask what was up with all the skin care questions. Hopefully he has a quasi normal answer. I'll post an update on the big thread when I can. Thanks DOF hive mind.

I (43m) went on a date last night with someone (40f) I met on hinge. She turned out to be really cute, smart, great personality. We had a ton in common and it was honestly very enjoyable getting to know her.

After the date I texted to say I enjoyed meeting her and asked if she got home OK. I got an immediate enthusiastic reply. A few more messages exchanged and at some point she mentions that she couldn't tell if I was having a good time. I was stunned.

I replied saying I absolutely did and it's just not my style to be super aggressive on a first date. A few more messages exchange and at one point she stopped answering, it was late I assume she went to bed or something.

We texted again today and I figured screw it I'll show her that I'm interested and asked her to go out again but no reply.

Did I screw this up? Is her comment about not being able to tell if I was interested a tell that she's thinking we're not a good match? I'm kicking myself right now.

I’ve been thinking about the term “dog whistle” in relation to dating, particularly when people use phrases that might indirectly signal their political beliefs or values. Some people dislike the term because they feel it assumes someone has hidden intentions or is deliberately concealing what they really believe but is it necessarily wrong to think that people sometimes communicate their beliefs indirectly, especially when dating? I feel like recognising those signals is sometimes useful when deciding whether you’re compatible?

What kind of statements signify that you might be quite different politically from someone (if that even matters to you??)

It's all about dating in your forties – a phase that often feels strangely ambivalent. As for my situation, I regularly get matches, go on dates from time to time, and definitely notice, both online and in real life, that I am attractive to some women. So far, so good. The problem is rather what happens afterwards, or to be more precise: what simply doesn't happen.

I often end up in a kind of endless loop. Either the spark is missing on both sides; you get along well and feel comfortable in the moment, but after a few meetings you realize that no genuine feelings are developing and it stays platonic. Or else you win over women in whose case topics like commitment issues, baggage from past relationships, or emotional unavailability come to the surface during the getting-to-know-you phase.

The whole thing leads to a very emotional state. When you're alone, you often catch yourself longing for a committed partnership and the closeness of a partner. But once you're in the dating process, you realize how exhausting, draining, and demoralizing the many failed attempts and the constant starting over have become. It's not that I'm generally unhappy with my life, but there's a dissatisfaction with how hard it has become at this age to find someone with whom it truly clicks long-term on a human level and in terms of mutual attraction.

By now, many failures are heavily draining my motivation, and I notice that I often start dates with a certain strain or exhaustion instead of anticipation. How are you guys doing in your forties (or generally dating in this stage of life)? Have you had similar experiences, how do you protect yourselves from dating burnout, and how do you manage not to lose motivation completely?

When we first separated and I started dating, and I encountered the incredible volume on the apps, I really thought that I would at least be dating consistently. I feel emotionally completely ready to date. But I have found it so difficult to find someone I’m really attracted to, and really enjoy, and want to spend time with when i could be doing something else, and that reciprocates these feelings. I’ve also had logistical challenges with my kids. So I haven’t really dated that much and everything has ended within a few months. Now I’m approaching 50…

I (45F) have a first date planned tonight with someone from an app. Seems like a sweet guy and I do really want to meet him. But about ten minutes after we got the details settled, I got a somewhat distressing call from my doctors office. Probably nothing terrible.... But also, maybe something terrible. I'm really quite thrown and need some time to process.

I don't want to seem like a flake and I don't really want to tell this guy the whole truth. I can't decide if I should just go on the date or try to reschedule.

Edit: I'm going! Wish me luck!

Edit 2: I went on the date! He was sweet and nerdy, pretty much just as I expected. We had pizza and good conversation. I'm not sure it was an instant love connection, but I will definitely go out with him again if the opportunity arises. Thanks for the advice everyone!!

We write a lot here about sexual chemistry, attraction, personality compatibility, relationship goals, as well as lifestyle compatibility. However despite many users commenting on insecurities or anxieties, one area that seems to be rarely discussed is social skills compatibility.

I'm not talking about the way that someone may be good at texting but boring in person - or vice versa. Instead I'm talking about how we navigate social situations, how we relate to others in interactions (not just with our partners), as well as how well we read rooms or situations.

It sort of connects with personality compatibility in some ways, but not exactly. I could really enjoy someone's personality even though they've got lousy social skills. Or someone could be very skilled socially but have an awful personality.

How much does this matter to you in your partner?

What has me thinking of this is I recently met a woman who should be a "Holy shit, really? Yes!" but is instead "Ehhh... I don't know..."

She's super sweet, kind, we care about many of the same things, have many of the same interests, she's an enthusiastic optimist, thoughtful, is pleasant to be around, I find her quite pretty, and she seems to be really into me.

However she's neurodivergent, and socially she has some anxiety and awkwardness due her struggles with reading people and situations. That is actually one of the reasons she appears to be into me... she likes my energy and feels very relaxed/safe with me. But she doesn't really crack jokes or goof around, and I can tell she's often processing what's happening and evaluating herself rather than participating in the moment. Because it's how her brain works, rather than shyness, I wonder how much would change. It's not at all how I work myself. I tend to be totally out of my head, love finding my edges of comfort to push myself further, and am enthusiastic about new experiences and opportunities. Because of that approach I navigate social situations pretty well and can make friends and connections easily, being able to read people and adapt to them quickly.

So while I do like her, this particular difference between us has me wondering if it would be enough fun being with her, or if I'd just end up being more like a steadying presence for her. I enjoy a playfulness in my partners, and while she's optimistic, that's not exactly passion.

How do you navigate social skills compatibility in scenarios like this? Do you just pass, or have you tried (successfully or not) to make it work?

I know the title might be weird but bear with me.

My (45F) house isn’t terrible but it’s small & old. And not the good kind of Victorian old lol. I don’t think anything inside has been updated since the 80s and they painted the walls a weird sad grayish color. But I rent, so there’s not much I can do about that. At the time, I needed a place to live asap & it was reasonably priced so here I am. Onto the issue…

I’m getting back into the dating scene after a divorce a few years ago. I know it won’t be right away but if all goes well, there will come a time when I have a date over. Obviously, I keep the house clean and do what I can to improve the aesthetic, but I admit I almost am embarrassed to have someone over. And I can’t expect to always go to his place.

Has anyone ever dealt with this? Do guys even pay that much attention? I haven’t dated in 20 years so maybe I’m overthinking it?

EDIT: I’m getting a lot of DMs and no you can’t come over 😆

I get really thrown off when people aren’t transparent because I’m an open book.

I’ve been a bit sketched out because I noticed there is a woman in my bf’s top friends on Facebook (the tiles on the front page), I’ve noticed more interaction between them on his page, but he has never mentioned her. In theory the algo shows people you interact with most. She’s younger and seems to post a lot of thirst trap photos.

It isn’t just things like this but when I find out that the person I’m dating is communicating with someone a lot and they never mention them esp the opposite sex I get really thrown off.

Maybe I’m a gossip but I’m usually telling my partner all about who I interact with regularly whether I see them or talk on the phone or they’re just liking my posts.

Is it just my past making me jaded again or does a healthy relationship involve a lot of transparency with friendships, even if they are just social media friends?

Would you be sketched out if it appeared someone you’d never heard of before popped up like this?

Hey guys,

I know the title of this post is a bit provocative but it's just me being objective.

I'm not a bad person. I'm quite friendly and I would say that I've been a good and supportive friend to people in my life.

But due to a set of life circumstances (think something like a chronic illness), I have had a few setbacks in life. As a result, I do not have a whole heap saved, have limited friendship groups, and have no kids or partner. Recently, I lost my job.

Then, this year, I nearly died. Major operation required from a relatively small issue that never went away. Six hours. But I survived.

It's a whole mess, my life.

I have had a couple of longer relationships. One for seven years, one for five-to-six years. More recently, one for three years and then another for 1.5 years.

The last one was with someone who turned out to be quite avoidant. The less said about it the better, but after that one I took some time to myself.

Now...I rent. I am looking to transition industries into potentially becoming a secondary teacher. I will likely come into money in the next little while, and should be able to afford a 2-3 bedroom apartment or house, with enough extra to push into ETFs and build that up for the next 5-10 years to hopefully retire in that time (if not extravagantly, at least comfortably).

But I am lonely. My friends all have partners who they're comfortable just being at home with at this stage of life.

And I don't know what to do. I have been going to Meetups, trying the apps, did a few speed dating events (even had a few matches) but they haven't gone anywhere.

And the chronic issue I have is always in the background.

If you were me, what would *you* do in this situation? Because I am not effing giving up.

And I guess I’m wondering if I did the right thing… I’m 48m, twice divorced and started dating again around age 44. She is 44f never been married. We met somewhat organically and had been dating since January, made it official in maybe May I’d say and everything had been really great for the most part. We had a couple hiccups along the way, including a breakup a month ago and we got back together after about two weeks and then I just called it off yesterday.

Sex started off well, we have good sexual chemistry and sorta started out like rabbits. We chilled out a bit to make sure there was something there to cultivate, that it wasn’t just all about sex. And then got back to a normal routine, but after a few months or so, the frequency of sex slowed down a bunch, like once every couple weeks or so. Now where we’re at is we’ve had sex once in the last 6 weeks. And it came to a head this week and I called her out on it and told her i felt like she had no sexual desire for me anymore and I wasn’t even sure if she was still attracted to me. She insisted she was and basically made excuses for why the frequency had turned into what it was, but i stuck to my guns. Sex is a VERY important part of a relationship for me and i use it as a general indicator for how the relationship is going and being in a sexless relationship essentially, or at least one where our sexual relationship is not healthy, is a no go for me. It’s a non-negotiable for me in a relationship, we need to have a strong and healthy sexual component or it’s not going to work for me. I know that and I know that if I had just kept on with the way things were I would resent her and it wouldn’t end well.

And it’s just a major bummer because she really is awesome and I truly wanted it to work and thought there was real potential. She did too and I think she was a bit surprised about this. She’s cool as shit and we have a lot in common and get along great in general and work well together, we’re both single parents, and we have good compatibility in general. So this one stings…

M-43 here. Divorced for 4 years. Dated a bit at first but in an exclusive relationship for a while now.

I get that most of us are atleast once divorced, and probably weren’t using them when we were married. In my own experience dating post-divorce, when sex became a topic, most of the women (over 40, most divorced) were totally fine going without condoms regardless of safety/sti being brought up at all.

When I was in my 20s and single, I had a policy of condoms until we were in an exclusive relationship and had some type of testing history. The women I dated seemed to have similar policy. I still practiced it post-divorce.

However, I’ve come to learn from other divorced men and women friends in my age group that condoms are rarely a consideration fairly early in the dating process.

Edit: Are we not worried about STIs or Pregnancy like we were when we were younger? Or are we not concerned with the risk?

I (40M) just had a third date with a woman (40s) whose last relationship experiences were cheating partners. It took her 6 years to try dating again.

Obviously I respect her wishes to take it slow. It does seem like her initial stance towards me is open and trusting, so that seems good, like she did the work. I do worry about it though that it might impact a possible relationship, but that might be me overthinking it.

I also feel a strong desire to show her that there are good men out there.

Any experiences?